Beginner Saxes Volume of Sound

[Bron357]

Mature age beginner here.
Maybe a weird question. I’ve played clarinet in the past and came across a nice Yamaha YAS 25 at auction for super super cheap so why not. In fact it turned out the included mouthpiece, a Selmer, sells for as much used on eBay as I paid for the instrument with case, cleaning cloths, reeds etc.
I set up the instrument and gave it a blow.
OMG are saxophones normally this loud? Compared to a clarinet sound I feel that I could act as a warning signal for icebergs! Forget the next door neighbors, the people two streets over are probably now aware someone has an instrument that sounds like a fog horn.
Am I over blowing or something? Is it the wrong reed?
It came with some new 2 strength reeds which I presumed are ok for a beginner? I played with 2 1/2 on clarinet back in the day.
It seems to be playing all notes ok but I assume I should take it in for a service?

 

[wakyct]

When I first started practicing my next door neighbor (maybe 75 feet away?) would regularly text saxophone memes.

On the other hand, I was chatting with another neighbor several houses away recently, and he didn't know I played, though he did say "I have heard someone playing the clarinet".

A friend who plays trumpet and I tested each other's volume once (with a phone decibel app), and standing outside the house the saxophone wasn't much louder than a windy day.

Take heart, at least you didn't pick up the trumpet.

 

[Wai Lung]

I play tenor. I haven't really used phone apps to test how loud it was in decibels. I think saxophones are kind of inherently loud.
When I first started, in retrospect, I was so loud and overblowing all over to assure myself that I could make some sound out of it. I used 2 strength reeds too, on a Yamaha 4C mouthpiece. The horn was leaking in many places. That must have been a factor that I was blowing too hard to compensate, yet instrument would not be the only factor. I do believe taking it to a technician to check it over is one good way to take out one of the variables.
It took me months and probably years to control playing volume down to whispering not disturbing family members studying upstairs.
Perhaps mouthpiece is another factor. These days if I want to do quiet practice and/or not overwhelming the vocalists, I switch to my old trusty Otto Link Tone Edge instead of the more brilliant sounding Super Tone Master.

 

[skeller047]

Saxophones are loud. They can be played softly, but they are much louder than a clarinet. That’s why concert bands have 8-10 clarinets and only 2 or 3 saxophones.

Paraphrasing Einstein:
Saxophones should be as loud as possible, but no louder.

 

[PiccoloPirate]

For blind Sailors, you could get work at a Lighthouse. 🎶🎶🎶🎶🎶 🏴‍☠️

 

[atwl77]

97-100dB.

That's what my dedicated SPL meter, about arms length from me playing on alto, says.

That's on "normal" mode which, I suppose, in written music will probably be around mf range? That's just with a classical mouthpiece, I have another metal high baffle one which, on average, is about 3dB louder at "normal" levels. Can go much higher, also can go much lower.

 

[Targa]

For blind Sailors, you could get work at a Lighthouse. 🎶🎶🎶🎶🎶 🏴‍☠️

That reminds me of a woman I knew who asked if the beeping sound at zebra crossings was to let blind drivers know there was a pedestrian using it.

(Admittedly she did immediately laugh at herself.)

 

[Bron357]

Thanks all. Daughter is now home and is giving it a blow. She plays bass clarinet and is rather enjoying my new purchase.
I’ll invest in a service, the lowest notes are squeaking, and go from there. Woo Hoo.

 

[Vlad]

The saxophone can be played 'quietly' listen to someone like Stan Getz. I myself prefer to use a kind of subtone most of the time. It doesn't have to be a fog horn 🙂

 

[Colin the Bear]

Saxophone can be quiet or loud.

Clarinet can be quiet or loud.

It's easier to be quiet on clarinet and loud on saxophone.

A leaky saxophone honks.

 

[turf3]

Remember, this instrument was invented to be the bass instrument (yes, the first saxophone was the bass saxophone) in outdoors military marching bands.

Beginners don't have the muscular control yet to be able to play softly. It's a lot harder to play softly with control than to play loudly. That's why "Li'l Darlin' " is the hardest tune in the book.

 

[lydian]

Exactly. The sax was designed to be loud. If loud, low woodwinds had already existed, Adolph probably wouldn't have been compelled to invent the sax.

However, it can certainly be played whisper quiet with practice. I recommend you take in less mouthpiece a use softer reeds until your skills develop a little more.

 

[Pete Thomas]

Remember, this instrument was invented to be the bass instrument (yes, the first saxophone was the bass saxophone) in outdoors military marching bands.

I thought it was also there to provide a "strings" element to military bands, ie a bit of a contrast to the brash brassyness of the brash brass. But didn't he also intend them to be an addition to the symphony orchestra?

 

[turf3]

Exactly. The sax was designed to be loud. If loud, low woodwinds had already existed, Adolph probably wouldn't have been compelled to invent the sax.

However, it can certainly be played whisper quiet with practice. I recommend you take in less mouthpiece a use softer reeds until your skills develop a little more.

In fact, the saxophone and tuba are roughly contemporaries in their invention - the valve tuba being patented 1835 and the saxophone 1846. The first saxophones were marchable (although anyone who's played a bass sax off a strap knows it's not light), standard tuba form is difficult to march with, the helicon form would have come somewhat later. So for a period there, the valve tuba and bass saxophone were direct competitors to provide a loud bass instrument for bands. It wasn't restricted at that point to woodwinds. Comparing either one to the ophicleide, serpent, or bassoon it's pretty easy to see their superiority.

Basically the way I understand it is that a lot of people were out there trying to develop an in-tune, loud, bass instrument that wasn't the double-bass. As the modern wind instrument families got built up in the mid-1800s, the treble instruments came first - the Boehm flute, Boehm and Albert clarinets, valved trumpets, valve horns, modern(ish) oboe system, improved bassoon. But bass flutes are too quiet, bass clarinets are pretty quiet and unwieldy, double reeds too quiet. So you end up with the brass family - specifically, changing from the large keyed bugle (ophicleide) to a valved concept, and applying a single reed and keyed tone holes to a wide conical bore like the ophicleide. I suspect Sax may have done initial experimenting with a single reed on the ophicleide. But it needed a Boehm/Sax style keywork to be reliable, which Sax did.

I wonder why a large bore trombone with a double wrap slide - as the few true contrabass trombones - did not take off.

Of course as we know, in the end the tuba won as the default loud bass instrument for bands (and orchestras), and by 1900 or so I believe that if there was a bass sax in the band it was in addition to brass bass, not instead of it. I suspect the mechanical complexity of the bass saxophone had a lot to do with the preference for the tuba. Any of us who's been in high school band knows that the tuba will keep playing with a considerable amount of dents and bends - as long as the valves still work, and there's only 3 or 4 of them, and they're in a pretty protected place - whereas the bass sax - you look at it wrong and it goes out of adjustment.

 

[turf3]

I thought it was also there to provide a "strings" element to military bands, ie a bit of a contrast to the brash brassyness of the brash brass. But didn't he also intend them to be an addition to the symphony orchestra?

Yes, the orchestra didn't have a reliable in tune bass wind instrument either. As we know, the tuba won out, but the bass sax was a contender.

Now this next bit is 100% speculation, but I wouldn't be the least bit surprised to see in musical magazines and journals and advertisements of the 1860s through 1890s or so, claims and competing claims about the superiority of tuba vs. bass sax -

"The So and So Philharmonic Society use the Evette and Schaefer bass saxophone in preference to the brass bass, for its smoothness and ease of execution; clarinet and flute players easily learn to play the Evette and Schaefer bass saxophone; the flexible tone of the saxophone allows it to blend with any section the conductor desires, and can perform solo works with great ease, unlike the cumbersome and brassy tuba";

"Well, the This and That Symphony use Besson's tubas in preference to the bass saxophone; their tone blends well with the orchestra brass rather than the bass saxophone's overly vibrant sound that sticks out like a sore thumb; trombone and cornet players easily learn to play the Besson tuba; in mechanical reliability and durability it is demonstrably superior to the fragile and complex bass saxophone."

 

[PiccoloPirate]

Antoine-Joseph "Adolphe" Sax. 🎶🏴‍☠️🎶

Beginners can be loud and soft, if they learn to play correctly.
Study with a legit player, from day one.

Most of the third year students, age 13-15, that only studied with the school's music teacher, and took half hour private lessons, with that teacher, were pitifully weak sounding.
Started lessons with me, in late June thru the start of school in September, and had the music teachers, show up in the studio,
within a week after school started.
"What did you do to get them to be our best players, they asked"
My reply, with both Sax and Flute student's progress, "Just taught them how to play/practice correctly, with one hour lessons, each week."
Each lesson had them playing for 40 plus minutes.
Overtone exercises were important, as they never learned them.

 

[Vlad]

We had some discussion a few months back about Mr Sax, apparently his desire to have the saxophone accepted in the orchestra was stymied and blocked by a load of jealous competitors in the trade, who did some pretty nasty underhand stuff to effectively blacklist Sax and all his works. amazingly there was even an attempt to murder him too.. pretty astonishing stuff

 

[PiccoloPirate]

Sad that Adolphe never met Samuel. 😏

 

[Pete Thomas]

who did some pretty nasty underhand stuff to effectively blacklist Sax and all his works.

As if placing a bomb under his bed wasn't effective enough.

 

[PiccoloPirate]

Things not to say to a Saxophone player, after a magical set,
"Yo, you da Bomb" 🤯