All profit supporting special needs music education and Help Musicians
PPT Mouthpieces

SOTM - JUNE 2021: Three in Three

Guenne

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,187
Location
Austria
Bildschirmfoto 2021-06-10 um 10.25.01.png
 

nigeld

I don't need another mouthpiece; but . . .
Café Supporter
Messages
7,095
Location
Bristol, UK
I just want to check, but I think the backing track is not correct on All Blues? The first 4 bars of the head seem to be reperated, does not come into the D7 (for Bb instruments) until much later. It also tags on the first 4 bars at the end before the solo grove kicks in. It's almost like its an AABA format, but thats not how the music is written

I do have another All Blues backing track, but I do prefer the groove on this one.

As I don't read music, I can't answer. Maybe Nigel can keep track of such things, I just listen and play. I wasn't able to get the backing track I wanted. There are several.on YouTube you could possibly use. Sorry to be useless at that level

@PMason247 you are correct - the written notes match the first backing track that @randulo wanted to use.

The supplied backing track has an 8-bar intro and 4 bars extra between the end of the head first time and the solo section. It finishes with a simple 4-bar ending after the last repeat. It corresponds to the RealBook version but 6x for repeats and with a 4-bar coda at the end. Notes attached.
 

Attachments

  • All Blues Bb.pdf
    59.6 KB · Views: 3
  • All Blues Eb.pdf
    59.7 KB · Views: 1

randulo

Living the dream
Café Supporter
Messages
6,237
Location
France
Sorry for the confusion, i probably bit off more than I can chew. I only know how to listen and play along. My versions of such tunes don't necessarily follow the exact melodies, either.
 

PMason247

Member
Messages
107
Location
Kent, UK
@PMason247 you are correct - the written notes match the first backing track that @randulo wanted to use.

The supplied backing track has an 8-bar intro and 4 bars extra between the end of the head first time and the solo section. It finishes with a simple 4-bar ending after the last repeat. It corresponds to the RealBook version but 6x for repeats and with a 4-bar coda at the end. Notes attached.
Yes, that works better. Thanks!
The backing track is a nice temo and has a great groove.
 

randulo

Living the dream
Café Supporter
Messages
6,237
Location
France
I'm really sorry we couldn't all use the Bobby's backing track. Further, I tried to do a BiaB track and gave up, it was decent to a point, but just not very good. I made the 12/8 Albert King one with no problem, and Gravy Waltz was already a BiaB file somwhere.
 

Wade Cornell

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,402
Location
New Zealand and Australia

randulo

Living the dream
Café Supporter
Messages
6,237
Location
France
OK, my first take. Comments are welcome.
My opinion as host: AN impressive job! Your time is good, and that's something not available to everyone. Playing along with the vamp in the intro and the head were nicely phrased, well placed in time. Again, that's a gift, hard to come by if you don't have it. You do.

Throughout, there are nice ideas sprinkled around that could be put together in a more recognizable "structure" by repetition of phrase, then slightly changed but recognizable related phrase. You already do a little of that, instinctively, and it's cool.

Development: Your solo starts with some nice things, but I suggest they may be a little dense for the very beginning. Longer notes (or less complex phrases) in the first verse would leave more room to develop the energy. Near the middle, there's a part that would have been great in the first verse. In general, the long notes, just like you played at the very end, would have been a nice start. (Not too many, or too long, as the song begins with a lot of that. Just a little activity, or density.)

A couple of times during the IV chord, you played the one note that changes between I and IV, the major 3rd. This can be done, but it needs to be inside some kind of 'trick' that hides/justifies it, like say used as a passing note, resolving to the 'correct' Bb concert. These were in the middle of phrases, though, not shocking or insisted upon.

You did an admirable job, having not played it muchbefore. More coherence will come as you play it more, especially with real humans, reacting with you.

These suggestions, aren't meant to criticise, only to give you some things to think about.
 

PMason247

Member
Messages
107
Location
Kent, UK
My opinion as host: AN impressive job! Your time is good, and that's something not available to everyone. Playing along with the vamp in the intro and the head were nicely phrased, well placed in time. Again, that's a gift, hard to come by if you don't have it. You do.

Throughout, there are nice ideas sprinkled around that could be put together in a more recognizable "structure" by repetition of phrase, then slightly changed but recognizable related phrase. You already do a little of that, instinctively, and it's cool.

Development: Your solo starts with some nice things, but I suggest they may be a little dense for the very beginning. Longer notes (or less complex phrases) in the first verse would leave more room to develop the energy. Near the middle, there's a part that would have been great in the first verse. In general, the long notes, just like you played at the very end, would have been a nice start. (Not too many, or too long, as the song begins with a lot of that. Just a little activity, or density.)

A couple of times during the IV chord, you played the one note that changes between I and IV, the major 3rd. This can be done, but it needs to be inside some kind of 'trick' that hides/justifies it, like say used as a passing note, resolving to the 'correct' Bb concert. These were in the middle of phrases, though, not shocking or insisted upon.

You did an admirable job, having not played it muchbefore. More coherence will come as you play it more, especially with real humans, reacting with you.

These suggestions, aren't meant to criticise, only to give you some things to think about.
Many thanks for your kind words! And no criticism taken. It is difficult to get inspired when playing along to backing tracks, which in itself has taken some work. So I would love to start gigging again at some point (it has been a long time for me).

I will do some more work on the progression of the solo as you suggested, and post another take. One question I do have is what alterations can we play over these chords? Would be nice to add some colour. This is something I really want to work on, and not something I have studied in the past.

I'm also not so good with the mix on the laptop. So any tips on how to make the saxophone sound like its in the mix with the backing track would also be appreciated.
 

randulo

Living the dream
Café Supporter
Messages
6,237
Location
France
@PMason247 The mix is fine, unless you mean to publish, it's "close enough for jazz" :) I could hear everything.

One of the most common bases for jamming over those altered D and D# chords are symmetric scales and patterns. The whole-half scale starting on the 7th, i.e, C, D, D#,F etc. which is often either played as is, ascending, Over a D7#9 for example,
Screen Shot 2021-06-11 at 8.29.59 AM.png

or broken up in many ways, this is a typical one (again, over an altered dom D7th:

Screen Shot 2021-06-11 at 8.32.32 AM.png


Perfect example:
https://soundcloud.com/randulo%2Fwatermelon-dim-john-viavattine-sr%2Fs-0o6DO6YMUFg View: https://soundcloud.com/randulo/watermelon-dim-john-viavattine-sr/s-0o6DO6YMUFg



Watermelon Man turnaround, on the C John starts it on the third (E, F, G, G#), sounds good, no?

The whole tone scale is also a possibility, with some small, personal changes. The more advanced kinds of things were done by @Guenne in his take above, major triads (G chord with an E Maj triad) that can create what is in effect a 13b9, for example. Playing patterns can be a trap, though; they can sound like patterns, not music. ANd the whole-half has been used a lot in jazz, so really needs to be broken up.
 
Last edited:

PMason247

Member
Messages
107
Location
Kent, UK
@PMason247 The mix is fine, unless you mean to publish, it's "close enough for jazz" :) I could hear everything.

The most common basis for jamming over those altered D and D# chords are symmetric scales and patterns. The whole-half scale starting on the 7th, i.e, C, D, D#,F etc. which is often either played as is, ascending, Over a D7#9 for example,
View attachment 18419
or broken up in many ways, this is a typical one (again, over an altered dom D7th:

View attachment 18420

Perfect example:
https://soundcloud.com/randulo%2Fwatermelon-dim-john-viavattine-sr%2Fs-0o6DO6YMUFg View: https://soundcloud.com/randulo/watermelon-dim-john-viavattine-sr/s-0o6DO6YMUFg



Watermelon Man turnaround, on the C John starts it on the third (E, F, G, G#), sounds good, no?

The whole tone scale is also a possibility, with some small, personal changes. The more advanced kinds of things were done by @Guenne in his take above, major triads (G chord with an E Maj triad) that can create what is in effect a 13b9, for example. Playing patterns can be a trap, though; they can sound like patterns, not music. ANd the whole-half has been used a lot in jazz, so really needs to be broken up.
Thanks! I will experiment. Diminished scales is something I have been working on, but not net fully internalised. I will try that over the middle.
 

randulo

Living the dream
Café Supporter
Messages
6,237
Location
France
It's the Ides of June... or mid-june at least. Of the three songs, surely some of you can undertake a recording to share with us?I would say that All Blues is probably the easiest of the three in three.
 

Members online

Popular Discussions

Top Bottom