Saxophones Pork Tales: Saxophone Repair DIY Adventures.

Life around the barn.

Tales from a pig that likes to stick his nose into everything.

Paint that S. How difficult could it be ?

1) Search the net.
2) Find the color.
3) Order color.
4) Study task on University of YouTube, aka; For destruction by DYI presented by pro tech.

Do the cleaning & prep.

Paint and cleanup / detail the edges with hard cotton swabs. Sounds easy……

Yeah tha guy Matt makes it look easy.
Anyone remember your first experience cooking bacon crispy while still in the frying pan !

 

[PigSquealer]

Make a cutting mark just beyond halfway of the box. Cut and file / polish off any burrs. Then make a slight upward bend (shoe). This prevents the tip from digging in or binding in the box. Pic on right…pay attention to and know your tools.
Don’t fabricate a crooked shoe !😏

Fit check.
The heel of shoe is hopefully mid box with a slight uptick. Not so upwards that it contacts the bottom of key😩. Check the arc. In movement the contact area is only the heel of shoe. None on the edge of the box.

 

[PigSquealer]

Once all of the above is sorted. It’s back to finishing the spring needs. Or maybe not. One holding screw may work just fine or not !
My crystal ball has a bad sense of humor 😒
Remember that shard chunk from earlier ? Time to use it again.
Wood block scrap.
Poke a small hole into the wood.
Stack old bit on top of new spring.
Screw this to secure into the wood block.
Clamp into drill / pillar press vise.
Index flat spring favorably to prevent rotation while making new hole (#2). All the while align the position for C to C spacing of the two holes. This using the shard of history.

HSS Cobalt drill bit. No center mark used🤞🤞

Well fudge 😭 just a fuzz off😤

 

[PigSquealer]

I have a fix for this.
I have on hand some very small HSS Dremel bits of .060” in diameter.
Clamped in a small vise I elongated the hole to fit.
My Dremel unit has the extension cable attachment and is variable speed adjustable. 5,000 to 28,000 RPM. Too slow of a speed setting and the bit will chatter. This will break the cutting tip off. Too fast and the bit will not cut and possibly become ruined or dull.
Often hard metals cut best at slower speeds. Cutting lubricants can help.
From experience I set the speed around 11,000-13,000 RPM and slowly presented the bit. It cut just fine with good control. This with one hand holding the wand. The bit resting at an angle on the tape and my left hand index finger guiding the bit. Safety glasses are a must have for these kinds of tasks !!!

Fully assembled it’s time to make the new hinge rod.

 

[PigSquealer]

From the miscellaneous assortment pile I’ve found a proper threaded rod in a diameter of .0855”also a bit longer than needed. A very lucky find after digging in the pile for :20 minutes
The shouldered head needs to be fabricated. Option, make a complete spare from scratch. One BIG issue. I lack a threading die of an unknown pitch & true diameter for a pre WWI French thread. Best to cautiously enhance the spare I have.
The pin on right is what’s needed. The sax has six. All the same exact size.

 

[PigSquealer]

My idea is to make a bushing and solder it to the end of rod.

Sorry people for using inches in measurement. My accuracy is better in inches for this task.

I started with a small brass rod stock .125” in diameter. Turned 1/2” in length down to .112 (finished required is .110). Turning the outside first on solid stock keeps better true IMHO.
Let it cool for 5 and have some coffee.
Second move was starting a pilot hole with an .064” center point bit.

Next move was line drilling the center out in one pass to the full .082” ID.
A titanium bit used here.

I lightly faced the end. Then de-burred both the inside and inside edges by hand. Outside with a fine mill bastard file. Inside with a fine tooth ball rotary file held in a pin vise.
Final OD fit was achieved with a few light passes using the fine mill bastard again. The runout tolerance on my 1948 lathe new was +/- .002”. For this parts OD needs it was easier to hand fit.

 

[PigSquealer]

Next I verified the pin fit. With minor force it went in just fine.
A spot of blue sharpie pen for depth check.

I need .135” finished length. This measured .155. To close. I line drilled a bit more depth. Then parted off with a jewlelers saw.

I forgot to take a picture of the soldering step. Nothing exciting. Just everything cleaned / degreased in isopropyl alcohol. Fluxed, eight seconds of heat. A dab of Stay Brite solder. Wash & treat with baking soda & water mix. A quick polish.

Then I checked final depth fit of head.

The head was spot on, so I proceeded to make the screw slot by hand. No power / bench motor used. The reason being is that the new head is minimally supported in the guide hole. Extremely bad time to have a jam up.

 

[PigSquealer]

I’m happy with the fit & finish.

I did start with a drawing. I don’t claim to be a draftsman or artist. A Pig print 🤪
Note. The thread is NOT 2.5-.45 metric.

 

[PigSquealer]

Good for another 123 years. Although I may remove the painters tape and add some more silk thread and beeswax.

Still dunno what to charge the customer 🤔 He may squeal at $150….plus the crook-receiver fit needs to be added.

 

[Tuppertn]

Still dunno what to charge the customer 🤔 He may squeal at $150….plus the crook-receiver fit needs to be added.

Make 'em squeal. Stick 'em for all you can get. You deserve it.

(Though I'm not saying you should do that to all your customers. 😉)

 

[PigSquealer]

Make 'em squeal. Stick 'em for all you can get. You deserve it.

(Though I'm not saying you should do that to all your customers. 😉)

Customer didn’t squeal @ $500, so I gave him a 100%🐷

 

[PigSquealer]

I made one goofball of a gadget today. A crook thread spinner wrapper thingy🤓.

Add cork grease then hot air heat to melt into the thread.

The crook thread 🤪 is slightly longer ( more than) before. I checked for fit intermittently during the (? spinning ? ) step.
Fit and ease of adjustment is actually very good. The tape inside the spool kept tension on for a tight wrap.

 

[skeller047]

I know some instruments, bassoon, for example, use thread instead of cork, presumably because the tenon being wrapped is fragile. But why do this on a saxophone? Just curiousity on my part, I am not questioning your work in any way.

 

[PigSquealer]

But why do this on a saxophone?

Longshot guess for using thread (and it is thread not string) is material shortage.
Second guess, the consistency of quality thin cork around 1920 to 1926. Holton produced many C Mel’s with red silk thread. It’s not many layers thick. So thin poor quality cork was superseded with thread. Holton alto & tenors retained cork.

 

[PigSquealer]

Other than Holton I am unaware of any other US maker that used thread instead of cork.

European makers history of this I do not know. This Evette & Schaeffer project is first I have seen. There is no signs of this ever having any adhesive on surface. There is a factory mark for material distance.

Why did i do this ?? Pure experience adventure. Will it work ? Time & how to install ?
Any benefit over cork ? Cost of materials etc. It’s funny what you can learn in :15 studying old stuff.
First test play didn’t go well. The thread worked well, but…
Neck to receiver desperately needs fit attention.
The neck octave touch lifts the key open about 45mm. It’s like having a snake pop up at nose level.
Leaks or my hand are bumping into palms or sides

 

[Pete Thomas]

The thread worked well, but…

I don’t understand how thread instead of cork would affect the octave key???

 

[PigSquealer]

I have another tenor on my bench that the previous tech used HMG instead of shellac.

Have you tried heat plus naphta? I think that's what I was using but I don't recall. All I remember is that the hot glue came out like nothing using a paper towel and some solvent and there are only a few in my kitchen, no acetone for sure.

I’ve just cleaned several using naphtha. It works, but not cold.
This is the attempt at cold use.
Starting point.

A small amount in cup, let soak :30 seconds and scrape with sharpened wood (chopstick used).

The goo wiped out with a paper napkin.

Too much residual left in cup.

To final clean. I gently heated the cup from inside. Then I stirred the solvent around with a Q-tip. Wiped clean again with a paper napkin. Lastly a quick pass with thick steel wool.

No I haven’t. Did you do this on a lacquered piece? I’ll experiment with this on another day. I use very little naphtha these days. The best deal I can find on a gallon is $77/gallon. That will buy a bunch of olive oil. The savings in labor time is worth the naphtha cost though.

The labor time savings IS worthwhile, but there’s risk. I’ll post next.

If naphtha works won't Gasoline or Kerosene?

The naphtha works just fine. It’s known to be safe on lacquer.

What works without damaging any finish is first concern.
Fire safety, handling / use and storage is also very important.
Costing doesn’t matter much. It’s a trade off between material cost and labor costs.

The flash point of the naphtha is still IMHO lower than California gasoline. California has different seasonal blends of gas. Ethanol content being the major variable.
Kerosene is not available.

 

[PigSquealer]

I don’t understand how thread instead of cork would affect the octave key???

Unrelated issue. I rebuilt the crook and forgot to set the touch action height.

 

[PigSquealer]

The labor time savings IS worthwhile, but there’s risk. I’ll post next.

RE; Naphtha use & safety.
It’s lighter fluid duh ! Have your bench & area cleared of any other flammable substances. Including the pile of used paper towels/ napkins. Have a fire extinguisher accessible.

I keep a used well sealing small container on hand to refill. 2oz will get the job done. No reason to have a larger risk on your bench.

Wear safety glasses or face shield.
Warm the cup from the inside. If it’s heated beyond comfortable to touch it’s too hot ! There is a chance of having a flash fire.
Hold the part away from you. Preferably in an open clear space away from your bench too.
Slowly pour the solvent into the cup. Just enough to wet the area. Place the solvent container an arms reach away for safety.
Then quickly work the area with your preferred tool. I do this on a cotton shop rag covered with a napkin. Be careful not to overfill the cup or slosh the mix outside of cup area. You’ll end up having a coating of HMG on your key face. The rag provides a soft working surface. The napkin will soak up any spill and is used for final wipe. Essentially a clean working surface for each key cleaned.

Probably overkill, but I give the cup a final pass with steel wool. The parts will be washed in soapy water afterwards.