Playing the saxophone Learning to Read v Playing by ear

Alice · Dec 20, 2019

Targa said:
Happy Birthday because it was Jesus' birthday.
Take Five is when handing round the giant tin of Quality Street.
Let It Be when trying to calm the traditional family disputes.
The German National Anthem because the traditional xmas was invented by Prince Albert.

Absolutely brilliant!

Regarding Take Five, if I’m going to have an ear worm then let it be this one.
“Let it be”... thank you @Targa ! I have an image of Sir Paul standing over a table of squabbling Scousers, telling them to calm down.

Targa · Dec 20, 2019

Alice said:
Absolutely brilliant!

Regarding Take Five, if I’m going to have an ear worm then let it be this one.
“Let it be”... thank you @Targa ! I have an image of Sir Paul standing over a table of squabbling Scousers, telling them to calm down.

I'm not very good at sharing the chocolates.

thomsax · Dec 20, 2019

I can read but I prefer leave my notstand and sheetmusic at home. When I was playing in a big band or saxophone octette I had to read all the time. To play the hornparts in a hornsection in Bluses, R&B, Rock. Soul bands... is not so hard. Pretty basic arrangments. I play it a couple of times and then I remember the music/notes. But even a hornsection in a rockband should be tight so it's important to practice, The horns use to do an extra rehearsal in between the band rehearsals. We are just playing for fun and we don't charge any money.

Zugzwang · Dec 20, 2019

Wanted to add a last 'reading' suggestion (if @sax panther hasn't given up and gone on holiday)
Adam Neely (Bass!) on YouTube suggested the best way to learn to read is to get hold of some Bach for practice, because it sounds great however slowly you play it (done it, it's true).
Will try to get find the link, but I think it was a Q&A so not much more than I've said.
...there you go...

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ua-N1JuqO5M&t=660s

StockholmSax · Dec 20, 2019

That was really interesting and sums it up for me.
Going to work on sight reading now.

gladsaxisme · Dec 23, 2019

StockholmSax said:
Yeah of course there is. My point is that everyone should be able to play a simple Christmas corrol without sheet music. Naw?

I think you don't realise how lucky you are to be able to hear a tune and automatically put your fingers on the correct keys it's a gift us less talented have to learn the written notes to get by

StockholmSax · Dec 23, 2019

This is a total misconception that it's a gift to play by ear. I was never born with this talent, I worked hard on this. I started with copying one note then moved on to nursery rhymes then moving to easy pop songs. I'm now a the stage where I'm finding sax solos on Spotify and trying to copy them. I'm no where near finished. Probably never will be. It's difficult but I enjoy it.
Certainly not a gift! Hard work.

mpj.brennan · Dec 23, 2019

StockholmSax said:
This is a total misconception that it's a gift to play by ear. I was never born with this talent, I worked hard on this. I started with copying one note then moved on to nursery rhymes then moving to easy pop songs. I'm now a the stage where I'm finding sax solos on Spotify and trying to copy them. I'm no where near finished. Probably never will be. It's difficult but I enjoy it.
Certainly not a gift! Hard work.

Good for you, but please bear in mind that whatever the field may be, there is a whole spectrum of latent ability in the population.

Pete Thomas · Dec 23, 2019

StockholmSax said:
This is a total misconception that it's a gift to play by ear.

I agree, it's a talent that can be learned. However there are a few people who seem to do it without any learning and in those cases I would say it is a gift.

I had to do a lot of work (still do). The problem d=for some people is they try to learn "parrot fashion" - note by note. I found that by studying music theory it bacame possible to recognise patterns in music and instead of trying to learn note by note or chord by chord it suddenly became a whole lot easier.

Veggie Dave · Dec 23, 2019

Pete Thomas said:
I found that by studying music theory it bacame possible to recognise patterns in music and instead of trying to learn note by note or chord by chord it suddenly became a whole lot easier.

I always thought being able to 'instantly' play a melody/riff was down mostly to recognising a pattern you already know, whether from theory, because it's common in that genre or simply because you've already learned a song that contains it.

6441 · Dec 23, 2019

Pete Thomas said:
possible to recognise patterns in music

Absolutely, although my reading has never been even decent, I studied harmony, melody and rhythm and it's my opinion that knowing the relation between two notes is a huge part of this. In a song in C minor, if a solo starts on the sixth (A) you should be able to hear that instantly. The difficulty comes more when the notes are short and numerous. So the first time you hear the first three notes of Equinox, you should be able to recognize them. If you don't have perfect pitch (and few of us do), you hear the relation and know it's 5 __ b3 __ tonic.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5QGBHavF0U&feature=youtu.be&t=28

By the way, what a brilliant composition with just a few notes!

Tenor Viol · Dec 23, 2019

6441 said:
Absolutely, although my reading has never been even decent, I studied harmony, melody and rhythm and it's my opinion that knowing the relation between two notes is a huge part of this. In a song in C minor, if a solo starts on the sixth (A) you should be able to hear that instantly. The difficulty comes more when the notes are short and numerous. So the first time you hear the first three notes of Equinox, you should be able to recognize them. If you don't have perfect pitch (and few of us do), you hear the relation and know it's 5 __ b3 __ tonic.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w5QGBHavF0U&feature=youtu.be&t=28

By the way, what a brilliant composition with just a few notes!

hmm sounds like the opening of Beethoven Piano Concerto #3 in reverse...

View: https://youtu.be/8m0JMErygG0

Colin the Bear · Dec 23, 2019

I was asked "Do you read?" Yes. "Do you sight read?" Only if I know how it goes.

Given a band part for trombone, to play on baritone, I typed it into a sequencer and played along with the music.

These days, with the ensembles I play with, I can bluff it out.

Vetinari · Dec 23, 2019

Playing sheet music starting at the end and playing back to start can make good reading practice, and, in some cases that it was a reversed copy of another piece.

Halfers · Dec 23, 2019

6441 said:
Absolutely, although my reading has never been even decent, I studied harmony, melody and rhythm and it's my opinion that knowing the relation between two notes is a huge part of this. In a song in C minor, if a solo starts on the sixth (A) you should be able to hear that instantly. The difficulty comes more when the notes are short and numerous. So the first time you hear the first three notes of Equinox, you should be able to recognize them. If you don't have perfect pitch (and few of us do), you hear the relation and know it's 5 __ b3 __ tonic.
By the way, what a brilliant composition with just a few notes!

It's the Theme tune to 'The Sweeney' for me.

View: https://youtu.be/ix6wTN_CH4g?t=8

6441 · Dec 23, 2019

Let's face it, 1, 3 and 5 are the basis of a lot of music!

Ivan · Dec 28, 2019

6441 said:
, if a solo starts on the sixth (A) you should be able to hear that instantly. The difficulty comes more when the notes are short and numerous. So the first time you hear the first three notes of Equinox, you should be able to recognize them. If you don't have perfect pitch (and few of us do), you hear the relation and know it's 5 __ b3 __ tonic

That John Coltrane piece opens up a can of musical worms. There is 5 __ b3 __ tonic: but the push and pull of tone during the head seems like he's already nudging impatiently into the starting gate, straining to let loose. In other words it's not just a straight 5__ b3 __ tonic

Zugzwang · Dec 28, 2019

gladsaxisme said:
I think you don't realise how lucky you are to be able to hear a tune and automatically put your fingers on the correct keys it's a gift us less talented have to learn the written notes to get by

Lucky? Is there an emoji for phooey?
I bet anything that everyone here (say, over 20) has heard this:
“Oh, you play sax? I’ve always wanted to… Why don’t I? Oh no, I couldn’t, I’m not musical. … … No I’ve never tried anything, I just know…”
…

Jeanette · Dec 28, 2019

Zugzwang said:
Lucky? Is there an emoji for phooey?

The harder I work the luckier I get 😉

Jx

6441 · Dec 28, 2019

I believe that all humans should be exposed to music and have the chance to try to play an instrument or sing. That they all could play is a different story. But for your own pleasure, I think anyone could eventually enjoy piano, drums, guitar. Wind and brass are already harder just to produce a sound. Starting at a young age, though maybe it's possible for anyone to get there?