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Playing the saxophone First year on tenor sax
Hello there, this year I play tenor saxophone for my high school band, I originally played clarinet. There's only one other person in my section and he's already perfect on it as he used to play alto. I have been in and out of tenor for the past 2 years and I was wondering how I can get better? My director says I have pretty good tone but I really want to improve 😀
2 Replies
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29 views
Tech/maintenance Just a general question to sax maintainers and repairers
Hi, and many thanks to any members who respond!
My question is whether I should give my Tenor Sax a complete overhaul (very probably!) and if so, whether I should look for a sax repairer who has specific knowledge, skills and reputation of overhauling 'vintage saxophones'.
TBH, I've asked questions on this topic to 'Google AI' and I've got some valuable responses. For example, the difference between 'regular sax maintenance' and 'complete overhauls'. Down to which local 'repairers' would be best qualified to overhaul my specific sax and the questions that I should ask them beforehand! All based on my specific Tenor sax model and year. Another 'Google AI' conclusion was that - on average - periodic 'minor sax maintenance' should be done every 1-2 years. And a 'major overhaul' might be needed every 5-10 years. My sax has had neither in 20 years!
So what I would like from experienced. informed and human sax repairers are their opinions on the answers that I got from Google AI based on the 'background 'below.
Background
I bought my 1961 'Buffet Crampon Super Dynaction' Tenor Sax about 20 years ago. At that time, it had been thoroughly 'checked out' and played easily in comparison to other 'vintage saxes' that I tried out. In the 20 years since, I've had a few minor 'playing problems' quickly inspected and fixed' by my local 'clarinet/sax' lady. Usually free of charge. But in these 20 years, my sax has never had 'periodic maintenance' or 'overhauls'
Lately (for the past 6 months or more), I've been really struggling to play my sax. With certain notes (G/G# in the higher octave) 'squeaking'. In my local sax lady's opinion (within 5 minutes) she said that the 2 octave keys worked fine mechanically. So that any 'squeaks' were probably due to my 'embouchure'. Which hasn't changed in many years.
A new Tenor Sax player recently joined my Big Band. He had sax that looked to me 'unusual'. I asked him what it what it was and said it was a John Packer JP042 Bb Tenor. He explained that it was a 'temporary sax' while he was getting his Yamaha 'restored'. He added that he wasn't yet sure which one he'd stick with. With his permission I briefly tried out his sax with my mpc and reed. TBH the 'playability' of his (new) sax with mine was a huge difference between day (his) and night (mine)!
Yes I fully realize that the 'ergonomics' of saxes has moved on significantly between 1961 and the first mention of the John Packer JP042 on the cafe in 2011.
I 'Googled (AI)' my problem and it's advice (with recommendations) was to have my Tenor Sax refurbished (overhauled) by someone who has the 'credibility' of restoring 'vintage' (1961) saxes.
My question is whether I should give my Tenor Sax a complete overhaul (very probably!) and if so, whether I should look for a sax repairer who has specific knowledge, skills and reputation of overhauling 'vintage saxophones'.
TBH, I've asked questions on this topic to 'Google AI' and I've got some valuable responses. For example, the difference between 'regular sax maintenance' and 'complete overhauls'. Down to which local 'repairers' would be best qualified to overhaul my specific sax and the questions that I should ask them beforehand! All based on my specific Tenor sax model and year. Another 'Google AI' conclusion was that - on average - periodic 'minor sax maintenance' should be done every 1-2 years. And a 'major overhaul' might be needed every 5-10 years. My sax has had neither in 20 years!
So what I would like from experienced. informed and human sax repairers are their opinions on the answers that I got from Google AI based on the 'background 'below.
Background
I bought my 1961 'Buffet Crampon Super Dynaction' Tenor Sax about 20 years ago. At that time, it had been thoroughly 'checked out' and played easily in comparison to other 'vintage saxes' that I tried out. In the 20 years since, I've had a few minor 'playing problems' quickly inspected and fixed' by my local 'clarinet/sax' lady. Usually free of charge. But in these 20 years, my sax has never had 'periodic maintenance' or 'overhauls'
Lately (for the past 6 months or more), I've been really struggling to play my sax. With certain notes (G/G# in the higher octave) 'squeaking'. In my local sax lady's opinion (within 5 minutes) she said that the 2 octave keys worked fine mechanically. So that any 'squeaks' were probably due to my 'embouchure'. Which hasn't changed in many years.
A new Tenor Sax player recently joined my Big Band. He had sax that looked to me 'unusual'. I asked him what it what it was and said it was a John Packer JP042 Bb Tenor. He explained that it was a 'temporary sax' while he was getting his Yamaha 'restored'. He added that he wasn't yet sure which one he'd stick with. With his permission I briefly tried out his sax with my mpc and reed. TBH the 'playability' of his (new) sax with mine was a huge difference between day (his) and night (mine)!
Yes I fully realize that the 'ergonomics' of saxes has moved on significantly between 1961 and the first mention of the John Packer JP042 on the cafe in 2011.
I 'Googled (AI)' my problem and it's advice (with recommendations) was to have my Tenor Sax refurbished (overhauled) by someone who has the 'credibility' of restoring 'vintage' (1961) saxes.
28 Replies
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362 views
Blog Tenor Viol's musings
OK. I've thought about doing this for a while - setting up a general thread for me to post in, rather than necessarily creating a separate new thread every time for relatively minor matters, or discussion of how things are going etc.
So, the first item is my FB page got me with an Amazon advert and I seem to have ordered a jazz theory book... It will get delivered to the Amazon lockers at work on Monday
Tomorrow is a Café Trio/Quartet...Septet day where @trimmy is going to demonstrate ascending chromatic scales in augmented fourths, and descending in diminished fifths... 😀
Yesterday was a wind band concert in Maghull. There were about 85 of us playing. We had a contrabassoon in the band...
So, the first item is my FB page got me with an Amazon advert and I seem to have ordered a jazz theory book... It will get delivered to the Amazon lockers at work on Monday
Tomorrow is a Café Trio/Quartet...Septet day where @trimmy is going to demonstrate ascending chromatic scales in augmented fourths, and descending in diminished fifths... 😀
Yesterday was a wind band concert in Maghull. There were about 85 of us playing. We had a contrabassoon in the band...
1922 Replies
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110825 views
Saxophones Selmer Supreme alto (quick look)
Had a client bring two Selmer altos in yesterday - a Ref.54 for a service and a brand new solid silver Supreme.
First time I've had my hands on one.
It only came in for a quick tweak - so no time to run up a proper review, but I did notice a couple of things.
First up - the client brought it in because there was a problem when moving from low B to low Bb; a break in the transition.
This turned out to be a badly adjusted link between the low B and the low C#. In fact it wasn't really adjusted at all - so that when his finger rolled down onto the Bb touchpiece and just caught the C# touchpiece on the way, the C# would open about 3mm. That's plenty enough to knock out the low B.
And there was this:
This is the Bis Bb/G# adjuster bar. Take a look at that gap between the Bis Bb arm and the adjuster above it. In horn terms it's miles away.
The adjuster is actually set right in terms of its ability to close the Bis Bb - so you can't screw the adjuster in to take up the play. What this means is that the lower stack is set substantially higher than the upper.
I had a quick peek at the toneholes. Selmer are traditionally pretty good at getting the toneholes level, but I was rather disappointed with the low C on this horn:
I compared it with the Ref.54 - which still wasn't perfect but was rather flatter.
So, not a great start for the Supreme. It comes in at an eye-watering price, and for that kind of money I want all the boxes ticked...and then some. So I'd expect the out-of-box setup to be spot on and rather more precision when it comes to the toneholes. Y'know, a bit like a top-end Yani.
And then I had a blow on the Supreme.
I was expecting a 'Woah!' moment - and I got one...but not the one I wanted.
It prompted me to go back and forth between the Supreme and the Ref.54. The Ref is exactly what you'd expect from a Selmer. Nicely balanced, a 'big' sound with that characteristic Selmer mid-range oomph, slightly resistant but nonetheless punchy - with a wide spread of sound.
The Supreme felt very closed in, like it was keeping the sound huddled around itself. And where was the punch and clarity?
It had a sort of Paul Desmond thing going on...that sort of laid back, soft kind of approach. That's fine...if you can turn it on and off at will but it kind of comes stamped into the horn.
That really surprised me because it's dramatically different from the Ref - so-much-so that I had to put a light down the Supreme to see if there was a problem with one of the pads (nothing major...slight leak on the A, which didn't change the tone when corrected).
I can't say it's a conclusive impression because it's just that horn - but even accounting for variations between seemingly identical horns it seems a bit extreme.
I'm hoping the client is going to book the Supreme in for a proper setup once I've serviced the Ref - at which point I can do a proper run-down on it and see what's what.
First time I've had my hands on one.
It only came in for a quick tweak - so no time to run up a proper review, but I did notice a couple of things.
First up - the client brought it in because there was a problem when moving from low B to low Bb; a break in the transition.
This turned out to be a badly adjusted link between the low B and the low C#. In fact it wasn't really adjusted at all - so that when his finger rolled down onto the Bb touchpiece and just caught the C# touchpiece on the way, the C# would open about 3mm. That's plenty enough to knock out the low B.
And there was this:
This is the Bis Bb/G# adjuster bar. Take a look at that gap between the Bis Bb arm and the adjuster above it. In horn terms it's miles away.
The adjuster is actually set right in terms of its ability to close the Bis Bb - so you can't screw the adjuster in to take up the play. What this means is that the lower stack is set substantially higher than the upper.
I had a quick peek at the toneholes. Selmer are traditionally pretty good at getting the toneholes level, but I was rather disappointed with the low C on this horn:
I compared it with the Ref.54 - which still wasn't perfect but was rather flatter.
So, not a great start for the Supreme. It comes in at an eye-watering price, and for that kind of money I want all the boxes ticked...and then some. So I'd expect the out-of-box setup to be spot on and rather more precision when it comes to the toneholes. Y'know, a bit like a top-end Yani.
And then I had a blow on the Supreme.
I was expecting a 'Woah!' moment - and I got one...but not the one I wanted.
It prompted me to go back and forth between the Supreme and the Ref.54. The Ref is exactly what you'd expect from a Selmer. Nicely balanced, a 'big' sound with that characteristic Selmer mid-range oomph, slightly resistant but nonetheless punchy - with a wide spread of sound.
The Supreme felt very closed in, like it was keeping the sound huddled around itself. And where was the punch and clarity?
It had a sort of Paul Desmond thing going on...that sort of laid back, soft kind of approach. That's fine...if you can turn it on and off at will but it kind of comes stamped into the horn.
That really surprised me because it's dramatically different from the Ref - so-much-so that I had to put a light down the Supreme to see if there was a problem with one of the pads (nothing major...slight leak on the A, which didn't change the tone when corrected).
I can't say it's a conclusive impression because it's just that horn - but even accounting for variations between seemingly identical horns it seems a bit extreme.
I'm hoping the client is going to book the Supreme in for a proper setup once I've serviced the Ref - at which point I can do a proper run-down on it and see what's what.
79 Replies
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1941 views
The dates have been announced for the 2027 International Saxophone Symposium hosted by the Navy Band at George Mason University: January 8-9.
Plan your trip now if you're coming from afar.
Plan your trip now if you're coming from afar.
41 Replies
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1166 views
Tech/maintenance Key Rod Wobble
I have a saxophone where the key rod wobbles inside the bottom post right hand (lower stack). The key rod is fitted from below, so the wobble is at the slotted end of the rod. A consequence of this defect is that there is a lot of movement in the low "D" key.
I have read that one common way to repair key rod wobble inside posts is to use a special set of pliars to compress the post head.
Is there a DIY or temporary fix for this kind of problem? Is it possible to fit a sleeve on the key rod inside the post? Teflon tape?
I have read that one common way to repair key rod wobble inside posts is to use a special set of pliars to compress the post head.
Is there a DIY or temporary fix for this kind of problem? Is it possible to fit a sleeve on the key rod inside the post? Teflon tape?
10 Replies
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893 views
Saxophones Carrying a tenor on a (motor)bike?
I'm thinking of acquiring a secondhand Suzuki Van Van and learning to ride over the summer, the idea being that it will be fun, and more economical than my 4x4 for going to work and other short journeys, when the weather is reasonable. But on quite a few of those journeys I am accompanied by my tenor.
Anyone carry one on a bike, and got any advice please?
Anyone carry one on a bike, and got any advice please?
779 Replies
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84059 views
Miscellaneous watches
Before I subscribe a forum about watches, where I will realize that only expensive pieces made in 1962-63 are worth wearing,
is anyone knowledgeable about automatic watches and straps?
is anyone knowledgeable about automatic watches and straps?
870 Replies
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27984 views
Miscellaneous Is AI taking over!
I just made this with AI today (inspired by my daughters recent wedding) and was totally mind blown... The song itself, band, singer and sax solos were just too good... There's no future for humans in music if this is just the early stages!
Walk her to forever
Walk her to forever
640 Replies
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25766 views
Misc instruments What other instrument could you just not...
... get along with?
Lots of folks double or dabble; but have you ever fancied adding an instrument but just could not come to terms with it (or them)?
Myself, I fancy a blues harp/mouth organ. I just don't get it. Luckily, trying costs little in that case.
«this thread brought to you by the Department of Idle curiosity »
Lots of folks double or dabble; but have you ever fancied adding an instrument but just could not come to terms with it (or them)?
Myself, I fancy a blues harp/mouth organ. I just don't get it. Luckily, trying costs little in that case.
«this thread brought to you by the Department of Idle curiosity »
25 Replies
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396 views
TV/film/books Take It or Leave It
Not often a film comes out featuring a saxophones as the lead.
Looking forward to watching
View: https://youtu.be/vNYRpLksOK0
www.theguardian.com
Looking forward to watching
Take It or Leave It review – vividly atmospheric formative adventures of future pop princes Madness
Docufictional 1981 comedy captures the working-class ska-pop pranksters in their hungry years with an almost Loachian authenticity
0 Replies
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39 views
Mouthpiece/Lig FS Ted Klum London Baritone mouthpiece
Ted Klum baritone 7* tip London model
Bought quite recently - Howarth £470
Minimal use and still has protective plastic around part of it where ligature
fits
Bought quite recently - Howarth £470
Minimal use and still has protective plastic around part of it where ligature
0 Replies
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38 views
Saxophones Saxophones, rarely discussed
Everybody knows the nice horns that get talked about all the time (Selmer, Martin, Yamaha, etc). Then there are the good instruments less talked about but I would say still fairly well known (a Yamaha Vito stencil for example).
How about a topic for those worthy saxophones (I'll leave the definition of worthy alone for now) that are rarely discussed?
Yesterday I 'discovered' the F.E. Olds Super:
Obviously beauty is in the eye of the beholder but I have to say that is a very cool looking alto! With an interesting story as well, that you can find if you dig a bit here or at the other forum.
So, what other models might fit the topic?
How about a topic for those worthy saxophones (I'll leave the definition of worthy alone for now) that are rarely discussed?
Yesterday I 'discovered' the F.E. Olds Super:
Obviously beauty is in the eye of the beholder but I have to say that is a very cool looking alto! With an interesting story as well, that you can find if you dig a bit here or at the other forum.
So, what other models might fit the topic?
65 Replies
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1021 views
Saxophones Pork Tales: Saxophone Repair DIY Adventures.
Tales from a pig that likes to stick his nose into everything.
Paint that S. How difficult could it be ?
1) Search the net.
2) Find the color.
3) Order color.
4) Study task on University of YouTube, aka; For destruction by DYI presented by pro tech.
Do the cleaning & prep.
Paint and cleanup / detail the edges with hard cotton swabs. Sounds easy……
Yeah tha guy Matt makes it look easy.
Anyone remember your first experience cooking bacon crispy while still in the frying pan !
Paint that S. How difficult could it be ?
1) Search the net.
2) Find the color.
3) Order color.
4) Study task on University of YouTube, aka; For destruction by DYI presented by pro tech.
Do the cleaning & prep.
Paint and cleanup / detail the edges with hard cotton swabs. Sounds easy……
Yeah tha guy Matt makes it look easy.
Anyone remember your first experience cooking bacon crispy while still in the frying pan !
1063 Replies
·
60833 views
Sheet Music Johnny Hodges Transcriptions?
Hi all
Apologies if I'm repeating a past thread.
There seem to be no Johnny Hodges transcriptions out there! No Rabbit! I've found 'All of Me' and 'Things Ain't What They Used To Be' but that's about it. I really want 'I've Got It Bad and That Ain't Good' and 'I Didnt Know About You' in particular.
Now, I know I'll be told to have a go myself, and I'd love to! But I'm new to transcribing and it would be great to have something to work from and study alongside the recordings. I imagine because of the deceptive simplicity of a lot of Hodges solos (slower, fewer notes but LOTS of expressive playing) people are less inclined to transcribe them and share?
If anyone knows of a source for Hodges transcriptions, please let me know! Thanks.
Apologies if I'm repeating a past thread.
There seem to be no Johnny Hodges transcriptions out there! No Rabbit! I've found 'All of Me' and 'Things Ain't What They Used To Be' but that's about it. I really want 'I've Got It Bad and That Ain't Good' and 'I Didnt Know About You' in particular.
Now, I know I'll be told to have a go myself, and I'd love to! But I'm new to transcribing and it would be great to have something to work from and study alongside the recordings. I imagine because of the deceptive simplicity of a lot of Hodges solos (slower, fewer notes but LOTS of expressive playing) people are less inclined to transcribe them and share?
If anyone knows of a source for Hodges transcriptions, please let me know! Thanks.
20 Replies
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9496 views
Saxophones C Melody Saxophones
I've been interested in C Melody saxes, for a while.
Apparently, they were quite common in the 1920s-30s, and the general concensus seems to be that the designs got better as time went on. Earlier models were often made in High Pitch (a tuning system that predates using A=440Hz), and should be avoided, unless you want to accompany a Highland bagpipe player.
From what little research I've done, it seems Conn made some of the better sounding ones, and their later models were improvements over the earlier ones. The ones with a "straight" neck, similar to an alto, are supposed to be good. Personally, I don't really like the S shaped neck on a tenor.
Anyway, here's one I've asked about recently. I've posted a couple of these pictures in Ads's review discussion thread of the Sakkusu C Melody sax, but here's all I have.
This is a 1924/1925 Conn C Melody, currently for sale at the Trevor Jones shop in Bristol. It's in low pitch, has had a partial repad, and is ready to play.
Bristol is a bit far for me to visit so I asked if they could send me photos, particularly of the hand positions, because the ergonomics are a bit different on these old saxes, and C melody saxes in particular.
Ermm... there seems to be a 2 file upload limit. Hopefully, that's per post
The thumb rest is apparently soldered on, so can't be adjusted easily, but the position looks good for reaching the right side trill keys (Bb/C/high E). This seems to be an issue on the Sakkusu / Thoman C Melody (see https://cafesaxophone.com/threads/sakkusu-c-melody-saxophone-review.13705/Ads's Sakkusu C Melody review[/URL])
The "L" stamped below the serial number indicates it's built for "Low" pitch - i.e. designed for modern A=440Hz tuning. I've read different accounts of what was meant by High Pitch (and maybe there was more than one definition), but the consensus seems to be it was at least A=450Hz, or A=453Hz - kind of between semitones, in modern tuning, and too far out to compensate for by positioning the mouthpiece differently etc.
It's important to check for that when buying any brass or woodwind instrument from that period. I think military bands kept it going for a while longer, in Britain. Scottish bagpipe and Irish/Scottish Bb flute players tend to still use it, as I understand it. It's certainly the normal tuning for 5 or 6 key Bb flutes.
Apparently, they were quite common in the 1920s-30s, and the general concensus seems to be that the designs got better as time went on. Earlier models were often made in High Pitch (a tuning system that predates using A=440Hz), and should be avoided, unless you want to accompany a Highland bagpipe player.
From what little research I've done, it seems Conn made some of the better sounding ones, and their later models were improvements over the earlier ones. The ones with a "straight" neck, similar to an alto, are supposed to be good. Personally, I don't really like the S shaped neck on a tenor.
Anyway, here's one I've asked about recently. I've posted a couple of these pictures in Ads's review discussion thread of the Sakkusu C Melody sax, but here's all I have.
This is a 1924/1925 Conn C Melody, currently for sale at the Trevor Jones shop in Bristol. It's in low pitch, has had a partial repad, and is ready to play.
Bristol is a bit far for me to visit so I asked if they could send me photos, particularly of the hand positions, because the ergonomics are a bit different on these old saxes, and C melody saxes in particular.
Ermm... there seems to be a 2 file upload limit. Hopefully, that's per post
The thumb rest is apparently soldered on, so can't be adjusted easily, but the position looks good for reaching the right side trill keys (Bb/C/high E). This seems to be an issue on the Sakkusu / Thoman C Melody (see https://cafesaxophone.com/threads/sakkusu-c-melody-saxophone-review.13705/Ads's Sakkusu C Melody review[/URL])
The "L" stamped below the serial number indicates it's built for "Low" pitch - i.e. designed for modern A=440Hz tuning. I've read different accounts of what was meant by High Pitch (and maybe there was more than one definition), but the consensus seems to be it was at least A=450Hz, or A=453Hz - kind of between semitones, in modern tuning, and too far out to compensate for by positioning the mouthpiece differently etc.
It's important to check for that when buying any brass or woodwind instrument from that period. I think military bands kept it going for a while longer, in Britain. Scottish bagpipe and Irish/Scottish Bb flute players tend to still use it, as I understand it. It's certainly the normal tuning for 5 or 6 key Bb flutes.
668 Replies
·
73943 views
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