Ligatures Do ligatures affect the sound of a saxophone?

[spike]

I once went through this phase of ligs, reeds, mpcs - did all kinds of voodoo - even took up physical excercise and bought a book on brain training - however what eventually helped to reach my goal was after about thirty years of playing sax - I did three solid years of concentrated practice, listening very closely to my sound and paying super close attention to every movement in my mouth, jaws, neck, lungs, my breathing etc. Also of enormous importance is that the horn is absolutely airtight and in excellent mechanical order. I got my sound and playing to where I wanted it, without changing anything on my set up. That was about ten years ago now - my style is still the way I want it even though I took a dremel and nail file to my trusty old hand made guaradala last year - didn't really make any difference. My lig is a junk tin model picked up at a fleamarket. After both screws broke, I replaced them with a single thumb screw from a campagnolo gear change bracket. I can't detect any difference in sound or playing characteristics if I use the screw in the front channel or the rear. If I want to change my sound I do it by the way I play not by changing my equipment.

That's my story, I know I must be wrong or there wouldn't be a million dollar custom sax gear industry, but I do save a lotta bucks and sleepless nights and without the g.a.s. distraction am able to concentrate on other important aspects of my playing.

There's no absolute right way to play the horn, there's just your way, just do it.

gruss - spike

 

[skully12]

What's G.A.S?

 

[Saxlicker]

I get differences from ligatures but its not a sound (or tone) change.
This difference happens with mouthpiece material and reed placement as well.
I used to always think it was sound (or tone) change but more recently I tend to believe its something I can only describe as 'players feedback'.

One thing that really started to convince me that it was only a 'feedback' thing (and I don't really mean only....because the feedback is a positive experience) was :-

There have been a fair amount of times that I have forgotten to tighten the neck screw and the result was what I thought was a mellower sound.
Tighten it up and every time the whole thing felt harsher.
I just can't see a listener detecting that sort of difference but back to back playing with the loose or tightened neck, for the player is quite a difference.
But maybe that wont happen on every horn? Maybe the closeness of the fit of the neck to the body plays a part in this experience?

Saying all that, I wouldn't rule out a sound difference between a ligature from each extreme what ever that may be!

EDITED for clarity 9p.m.
P.S. GAS is
Gear
Aquisition
Syndrome

 

[old_git]

spike wrote:
That's my story, I know I must be wrong or there wouldn't be a million dollar custom sax gear industry, but I do save a lotta bucks and sleepless nights and without the g.a.s. distraction am able to concentrate on other important aspects of my playing.

There's no absolute right way to play the horn, there's just your way, just do it.

gruss - spike

Good on yer Spike but the million dollar custom sax gear industry does exist for a reason: To make money.
Unfortunately, like my fellow idiots, I believe, no, hope that there are shortcuts, and at my time of life, they'd better be. 🙁
You know how a new pair of unnecessary shoes, sets the wife up, maybe a little self-pampering is allowable.

 

[losaavedra]

I only want to mention that, as a result of various experiments, the position that a lig clamps onto the reed tail seems to me to be what matters. The maximum clamp-able part of a reed is some part or all of an overall distance of approximately 3.5cm. The lig, whatever type, will only clamp some part of the reed tail and WHICH part is clamped WILL (in my opinion) effect the tone. How it effects the tone seems to me to be as follows:

If the lig is clamping the reed too near the tail - squeaking and spontaneous octave jumping may result. Both are a nuisance but can be controlled albeit with some additional effort.

If the lig is clamping the reed close to the chamfer - I find there are no squeaks and no spontaneous octave jumping.

At this stage I cannot see that it matters what TYPE of lig is used, as long as it 'fits' suitably and does the appropriate positional clamping job.

It is possible that the ideal lig is one that clamps a reed FIRMLY for the WHOLE 3.5CM LENGTH of the tail. I have not come across one that can do that, however the compromise is one that MUST AT LEAST firmly clamp the front end of the tail i.e. the bit NEAREST to the chamfer and the player.

Please excuse the apparent SHOUTING in this post. It's solely to emphasise, and not intended to offend. I attempted to say the above in an earlier post in this thread and subsequently edited it all out as clearly one of our brethren thought I was being an idiot.

I am a newcomer to the sax. Part of any learning process, particularly with a new instrument, is to try to understand why some things work and other things don't ... this is not 'faffing about', it's about discovery. As I understand it everyone in this quite enlightened forum is entitled to say whatever they think as long as they are not offensive to others in doing so. I might revise my opinion later regarding ligs, as could someone else, but that too is part of learning.
I'll probably wish I hadn't posted in this thread (again!). It's the cheap red's fault!!!

 

[Pete Thomas]

losaavedra wrote:
I only want to mention that, as a result of various experiments, the position that a lig clamps onto the reed tail seems to me to be what matters.

I agree totally with this.

Perhaps I'm being rather conservative in believing a ligature is either working or not. If it's clamping correctly the saxophone plays properly, if it's clamping unevenly, (as recommended in some Rovner literarture) then it's not working properly and the tone will either be muffled or shrill & squeaky.

I have to admit that somewhere between the two extremes, there could be a state where its not quite working properly, and the resulting effect is a useful change in tone, however if that is the case the response the player feel is likely to suffer. I would prefer to make any changes to my sound by getting a new mouthpiece or saxophone.

It's just a hunch, I'm quite prepared to admit that one day I'll find a ligature that has a better sound than my normal cheap 2 screw or Rovners

 

[TomMapfumo]

Maybe you should have stuck with the Francois Louis lig for a little longer!
No, you obviously need an EVO-5. Martin at WWB could always lend you one for a trial period, as long as you don't get people to comment on what it sounds like, as he may turn nasty!!

Seriously, have a nice day!
Kind regards
Tom