CafeSaxophone Forum

Price was not that crazy when I bought it 20 years (?) ago. If it comforts you: The best mouthpiece I ever had (for me) is half the price…

I had one for a while. It's like a standard DV with the edge taken off, very nice. It can be loud, but harder reeds make it easier to control. The silver plating was prone to tarnishing. The latest ones are palladium plated so shouldn't have this problem.

Most falls are of a sort of indeterminate length and hence quite ragged. They can be anything from a small bend to a full on chromatic scale. If it’s a long fall you’d probably want to add some falling tailing off notes to the bend. If you literally cannot bend/lip the A then start off falling with scale notes that tail off. What scale? The easiest notes that fall nicely.

Always a good idea to discuss at rehearsal.

To play a fall - off: using chromatic or diatonic notes - I’d expect one of those squiggly lines (a glissando) to be written. The small curved line would usually mean to bend / “lip” down rather than what I’ve always called a fall - off.

Lip produces a (proper) glissando - a slide. Fingering a fast downward stepwise scale whilst diminuendoing to nothing (and maybe going towards subtone) is what I would call a fall - off.

- if you time your finger movements playing a scale sufficiently behind your embouchure it is possible to play a completely pure slide / glissando like the clarinet, though a lot harder without the open holes. It basically hinges on each note being very flat and that ratio staying as you move up. Same on clarinet really, the sliding fingers is the least of it.

It does depend upon where it is on the horn, who is playing what around you and how long the effect lasts. Trumpets might half valve it if long, which sounds like a slide, but if a “lip down” will probably just flatten that note and let the air go.

It’s like the opposite to a scoop (lip up to pitch, starting maybe a semitone or tone flat).

I think for me, that’s another distinction: the lip off is over a small interval and will be fast. A fall - off might be fast still, but will travel at least a minor 3rd down by end (has to be a chromatic scale or you only have one note in between) to longer, larger fall - offs which, if really big intervals are involved you’ll want to use whole steps more (in order to get anywhere fast enough). To a certain extent, any notes can be used if fingering “in key” is awkward, it will be heard as an effect, if fast enough. Otherwise, a slow(er) fall - off needs to follow harmony more.

The longer the note length the longer the effect. There are things to discuss with a section (if in one) here:

If over say, 4 beats or even longer; when does the effect start (and stop) etc. Will be more important in context for some tunes than others.

It’s not an exact science.

The Woodwind Forum went off-line forever on August 9, a month ago.

ghostler said:

The Woodwind Forum went off-line forever on August 9, a month ago.

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I've been really busy with hospital appointments

LarryS said:

I've been really busy with hospital appointments

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Understand. Internal discussions between us mods and admins, operating a large website with considerable archives and discussions stored has very expensive per month costs.

Over time more and more instrumentalists becoming adults seek social media instead of forums. They do not replace the older generation departing. Plus those older yet not seniors sought social media.

I saw this in model aeroplane and motorcycle forums, too. Stuka Stunt, Brotherhood of the Ring, both about flying control line model aircraft are no more.

About 12 years ago I saw BOTR posts dwindling because regulars left for social media. All the info including plans and historical info were lost. Because the owner did not open the site to SEO, none of its pages are archived, but the beauty was our conversations were all private.

The discussions were of a family nature, all adhered to good posting etiquette, don't get me wrong.

Ditto with Stuka. It was themed by a special competitive sort of semiscale stunt model based on the Stuka dive bomber featured in the model magazines of the time from 1950's on, but discussed many other stunt topics, too.

ghostler said:

Internal discussions between us mods and admins, operating a large website with considerable archives and discussions stored has very expensive per month costs.

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Tell me about it. I did think about offering to take on some of the archive but we are obviously close to being in the same boat as most traditional forums fighting for survival.

Pete Thomas said:

Tell me about it. I did think about offering to take on some of the archive but we are obviously close to being in the same boat as most traditional forums fighting for survival.

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This is understandable.

Probably the mostt important reference source on the WF was the Clarinet Perfection section, which was used as a reference source by a good number of woodwind forums. A clarinet professor with a named US university music department was proposing the possibility that it could be maintained on the university's server under the music department, which I think would be excellent. However, I don't know if that went any further.

ghostler said:

Understand. Internal discussions between us mods and admins, operating a large website with considerable archives and discussions stored has very expensive per month costs.

Over time more and more instrumentalists becoming adults seek social media instead of forums. They do not replace the older generation departing. Plus those older yet not seniors sought social media.

I saw this in model aeroplane and motorcycle forums, too. Stuka Stunt, Brotherhood of the Ring, both about flying control line model aircraft are no more.

About 12 years ago I saw BOTR posts dwindling because regulars left for social media. All the info including plans and historical info were lost. Because the owner did not open the site to SEO, none of its pages are archived, but the beauty was our conversations were all private.

The discussions were of a family nature, all adhered to good posting etiquette, don't get me wrong.

Ditto with Stuka. It was themed by a special competitive sort of semiscale stunt model based on the Stuka dive bomber featured in the model magazines of the time from 1950's on, but discussed many other stunt topics, too.

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Yes Facebook has a lot to answer for. The piano forum I've been a regular with since 2010 has been sold, largely due to the site owner retiring (good old Frank). But it had gone quiet long before that, with a lot of dodgy ads on the site. Thankfully it has a new home.

Keep in mind this is just the solder cleanup stage. A full polish is on order too.





Still work in progress.

PigSquealer said:

Keep in mind this is just the solder cleanup stage. A full polish is on order too.

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On thing I’ll add. It’s difficult to achieve 100% removal. I wouldn’t be the least bit surprised if some of these cleaned areas change color. A dull grey stain appearance. First truth on how well they’re cleaned will appear when the new mounting is soldered on.

SAM ASH website. Product info;

You Are Now Free to Roam About the Stage.
Featuring the world's smallest clip-on transmitter with a shockmounted microphone and adjustable gooseneck, this frequency-agile UHF wireless system provides high definition sound and 300' of reliable wireless operation for saxophones, trumpets, trombones and other wind instruments.

ATX-tend Your Reach
The AWX system continues Samson's longstanding commitment to wireless innovation. Designed to be an extension of your instrument rather than a separate component, the ATX Wireless Transmitter clips directly to your instrument bell with no beltpack or cable necessary and lets you rule the stage with confidence. It provides infrared sync to wirelessly match the receiver and transmitter frequency, easily accessible Gain and Mute controls, a battery life LED indicator and an 8-hour rechargeable lithium-ion battery.

Mic the Wind
The ATX transmitter features a HM60 condenser microphone with 3-point halo isolation mount to minimize any noise caused by mechanical vibration. The mic capsule offers a supercardioid pickup pattern that handles up to 125dB SPL, ideal for handling the sudden attack of wind instruments. The HM60 also offers an 8.5" adjustable gooseneck (with P3 connector) for optimal mic placement in front of your instrument’s bell.

Road-agile
Offering frequency-agile operation, the system's rack mountable CR99 Wireless Receiver provides 80 selectable channels for reliable performance no matter where you are. The receiver's True RF Diversity design minimizes dropouts, while tone key technology prevents unwanted noise when your transmitter is off or out of range.

AWX Wind Instrument System

• Frequency-agile UHF wireless system
• 80 operating channels across 24MHz bandwidth
• Clips directly to instrument bell (no beltpack or cable required)
• HM60 condenser microphone capsule with supercardioid pickup pattern
• Up to eight simultaneous systems per frequency band (region dependent)
• AC adapter and rackmount kit included

Get your Samson AWX Wind Instrument Wireless System today at the guaranteed lowest price from Sam Ash Direct with our 45-day return and 60-day price protection policy.

WARNING: This product contains DEHP, a chemical known to the State of California to cause birth defects and other reproductive harm.

Things You Will Get:

• CR99 Wireless Receiver
• ATX Wireless Transmitter
• HM60 Condenser Microphone
• 8.5" Gooseneck w/P3 connector
• Removable 1/4-wave antennas
• WindscreenAC adapter
• Rackmount kit
• Owner's Manual

See all Samson Instrument Wireless Systems

John Laughter said:

SAM ASH website. Product info;

You Are Now Free to Roam About the Stage.
Featuring the world's smallest clip-on transmitter with a shockmounted microphone and adjustable gooseneck, this frequency-agile UHF wireless system provides high definition sound and 300' of reliable wireless operation for saxophones, trumpets, trombones and other wind instruments.

ATX-tend Your Reach
The AWX system continues Samson's longstanding commitment to wireless innovation. Designed to be an extension of your instrument rather than a separate component, the ATX Wireless Transmitter clips directly to your instrument bell with no beltpack or cable necessary and lets you rule the stage with confidence. It provides infrared sync to wirelessly match the receiver and transmitter frequency, easily accessible Gain and Mute controls, a battery life LED indicator and an 8-hour rechargeable lithium-ion battery.

Mic the Wind
The ATX transmitter features a HM60 condenser microphone with 3-point halo isolation mount to minimize any noise caused by mechanical vibration. The mic capsule offers a supercardioid pickup pattern that handles up to 125dB SPL, ideal for handling the sudden attack of wind instruments. The HM60 also offers an 8.5" adjustable gooseneck (with P3 connector) for optimal mic placement in front of your instrument’s bell.

Road-agile
Offering frequency-agile operation, the system's rack mountable CR99 Wireless Receiver provides 80 selectable channels for reliable performance no matter where you are. The receiver's True RF Diversity design minimizes dropouts, while tone key technology prevents unwanted noise when your transmitter is off or out of range.

AWX Wind Instrument System

• Frequency-agile UHF wireless system
• 80 operating channels across 24MHz bandwidth
• Clips directly to instrument bell (no beltpack or cable required)
• HM60 condenser microphone capsule with supercardioid pickup pattern
• Up to eight simultaneous systems per frequency band (region dependent)
• AC adapter and rackmount kit included

Get your Samson AWX Wind Instrument Wireless System today at the guaranteed lowest price from Sam Ash Direct with our 45-day return and 60-day price protection policy.

WARNING: This product contains DEHP, a chemical known to the State of California to cause birth defects and other reproductive harm.

Things You Will Get:

• CR99 Wireless Receiver
• ATX Wireless Transmitter
• HM60 Condenser Microphone
• 8.5" Gooseneck w/P3 connector
• Removable 1/4-wave antennas
• WindscreenAC adapter
• Rackmount kit
• Owner's Manual

See all Samson Instrument Wireless Systems

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My CR99/ATX w HM60 mic for my sax works great indoors but embarrassed me w the excessive wind noise at a packed outdoor event. Is there another wind screen I can put over the existing one or do you have any suggestions ?? I never had this problem with the old airline systems (I had 2) and I want to stick with Samson.

Tommy M said:

My CR99/ATX w HM60 mic for my sax works great indoors but embarrassed me w the excessive wind noise at a packed outdoor event. Is there another wind screen I can put over the existing one or do you have any suggestions ?? I never had this problem with the old airline systems (I had 2) and I want to stick with Samson.

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Hi NorCal neighbor.
I would try contacting the Samson support directly.
Click on “where to buy” and find a local dealer is another option.

I hate hearing existential threat parroted all the time. Having a degree in Philosophy I can assure you that there hasn't been an existential threat since John-Paul Sartre.

Grumps said:

I hate hearing existential threat parroted all the time. Having a degree in Philosophy I can assure you that there hasn't been an existential threat since John-Paul Sartre.

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(and @Targa). It's interesting to sometimes learn a bit more about some members via this (and other) threads! It reminds me (again) that cafe members have a common interest (music, playing sax). But have different backgrounds, home countries, interests and 'lives' (outside of music and playing sax!). And they have different things going on in their lives. Leaving aside 'sax playing level', this 'diversity' of cafe members enriches (for me) the sense of 'community' in the cafe!

A pet peeve that is difficult for me to ignore, other than drivers who should have failed their driving test, is the prevalence of logical fallacies in the commentaries/diatribes/arguments of pundits on nearly all media platforms. Ignoramuses abound in our current polarized political environment. I wish rhetoric was required from grade 5 and integrated into all language arts curricula.

Another closely related pet peeve is the misuse of statistics. It’s so bad, I believe that 9 out of 10 people misuse the actual statistical data they attempt to reference or just make it up because it sounds right 😉

Politics. Where ideology supercedes facts.

Colin the Bear said:

Politics. Where ideology supercedes facts.

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Or like the very first post here, innocently advocating what to do with other people's money. But hey, it's not political because that makes good sense, right? Everyone's for health, right? Not inflammatory. As if...

But therein lies the rub. Folks being political see their political pronouncements as just restating the norm. It is correct, therefore they are justified and they are compelled to tell people. Folks need to listen and agree. And if you don't? Self-reflection is out the window. Instead, they'll put a red hat on you; and most ignorantly so.

Grumps said:

Or like the very first post here, innocently advocating what to do with other people's money. But hey, it's not political because that makes good sense, right? Everyone's for health, right? Not inflammatory. As if...

But therein lies the rub. Folks being political see their political pronouncements as just restating the norm. It is correct, therefore they are justified and they are compelled to tell people. Folks need to listen and agree. And if you don't? Self-reflection is out the window. Instead, they'll put a red hat on you; and most ignorantly so.

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Well, that was not what I meant, sorry you took it that way. The line you objected to was in quotes, as an example; I was not stating my opinion. I have one 🙂, and will be happy to discuss it in person in January when I see you (I hope).

The fact that you, an obviously intelligent person, misunderstood my post just highlights the problem that Pete and Jeanette struggle with daily. In text, it's difficult to express subtle distinctions that would be obvious in a face-to-face situation.

What "makes sense" to one person can be "completely off base" to another; it depends on their experience and upbringing, and (perhaps less) on their natural proclivities. I wish it were easier to accept other people's idiotic opinions, but it just isn't....

skeller047 said:

wish it were easier to accept other people's idiotic opinions, but it just isn't....

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But what you think is idiotic, someone else will not. And that my friends is where the problems start....

It's that type of language that starts a trail of posts to be deleted.😘


Jx

Jeanette said:

But what you think is idiotic, someone else will not. And that my friends is where the problems start....

It's that type of language that starts a trail of posts to be deleted.😘


Jx

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Yes - that illustrates exactly the problems you face. That line was delivered with tongue firmly in cheek...

skeller047 said:

Yes - that illustrates exactly the problems you face. That line was delivered with tongue firmly in cheek...

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Emojis can help get that point across 😏😘

I’m for any party 🥳 ! Especially if there’s free beer & food

I know of Ben Wendel and Ryan Devlin. Both very good modern players, Ryan is noted for his very energetic "outside" playing, and Ben wrote a great book on playing altissimo. Ben is also deeply into electronics; he did a very interesting interview with Rick Beato on YouTube a few months ago. I look forward to meeting both of them.

skeller047 said:

I know of Ben Wendel and Ryan Devlin. Both very good modern players, Ryan is noted for his very energetic "outside" playing, and Ben wrote a great book on playing altissimo. Ben is also deeply into electronics; he did a very interesting interview with Rick Beato on YouTube a few months ago. I look forward to meeting both of them.

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I look forward to hearing Ben play. The others I need to look up.
The interview Rick did with Ben was interesting. Just wild that Ben and Terrace Martin were High School band mates. Wasn’t there a thread on this interview when it came out ?
View: https://youtu.be/tMYcNZJm2Io?is=CbQxInNC3pXfKD9Q

Welcome aboard from South Florida.



I was once near Alaska, flying in the right seat of a B52, at about 40k.
I could see Russia looking forward, before making a U-turn.
Blue skies now just Blue water. 😍

PiccoloPirate said:

Welcome aboard from South Florida.

View attachment 37201

I was once near Alaska, flying in the right seat of a B52, at about 40k.
I could see Russia looking forward, before making a U-turn.
Blue skies now just Blue water. 😍

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I lived in Nome for 5 years. U-turns are still common along the International date line😉
I heard stories from locals that back in the day Soviet MiGs would fly low under the radar across the Bering Sea, pop up to wave “Hello” and drop back down as they were chased all the way to tomorrow.

JayL,
Are you Superman's father, from Krypton?

PiccoloPirate said:

JayL,
Are you Superman's father, from Krypton?

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That’s Jor-EL not JayL 🤦‍♂️.
I’ll have one of whatever you’re drinking 🤪

Total confusion since the Bum and linguistics threads.
Correct me please:
His Dad is called Jor-El in California
and in anyplace named Melbourne,
he's JayL? 🙄

I got (nicely) fooled this evening! I'd finished my 'volunteer shift' at BredaPhoto and took 2 buses home. As I was getting on the 2nd bus, the driver said "Hey Mike, how are you doing?". I looked at him but didn't recognise his face. Which occasionally happens when I meet people I've briefly met before but in a completely different 'context'. So I said "I'm doing fine, how are you?" Other passengers were also boarding so I moved on and sat down.

But I kept thinking "He obviously knows me, but I don't recognize him at all". So I went back up to the driver to try and clear up my confusion and mild discomfort. So I said something like "I'm sorry, you obviously know me but I can't for the life of me recall when we met. Perhaps in a different situation?". He said "No, I don't think so, I've been a bus driver for years". And then added "I have to start my ride now ..."

So I sat there for another 5 minutes before it dawned on me: I was wearing a 'BredaPhoto volunteer T-shirt'. With a 'name button' with "Mike" (which I'd completely forgotten about!). When the 'penny dropped', I started laughing and shouted out 'Good One!' to the driver.

He'd obviously simply read my 'name badge' as I boarded and carried on the conversation as if he 'knew me'. Leaving me to figure out the 'clue'. His sense of humour made my day!

Mike

Out walking the Dug this afternoon he discovered these.

Several people in the neighborhood leave baskets of seasonal fruit curbside. That’s $50 worth of pomegranates.

I always bring up the volume on solos and in my whole career, no director asked me to play quieter. I also often mark interesting and fun parts of my chart as SOLO so that I will bring it out to be heard over the often thundering herd. Again, no director has ever asked me to play softer. But I do get a *lot* of "bring it out a little louder" queues from the big band director when I play bari.

Gandalfe said:

I always bring up the volume on solos and in my whole career, no director asked me to play quieter.

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ghostler said:

I always brought out the solos by picking up the volume

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In the five years that I've been in the NHB, the words "you're too loud" were heard repeatedly by the band members. Our director for all of those years is now retired, but the words are very much ingrained in our brains. Only on rare occasions would anyone hear instructions otherwise, and generally those were the trombones. We would receive instructions for the majority of the band to play softer so that if a section or soloist was playing, they could be heard better. We're under different leadership now, so those words aren't uttered very often.
'Christmastime is here' is the last part of the medley. It's cool to be an important part of the what the audience will remember more than the songs that don't make up the beginning or the end. I also have a very nice part (along with many others) during what would be, lyrically, 'Christmastime is here'. I have four measures that have two beats of rest, and then alternating B and Ab, which I try to play softly in the background supporting the melody. These four measures are repeated, as is the soli.
I will do my best to be heard above the others without being obnoxious.

Normally if the conductor has full control of the band, the members shouldn't have anything to say about your dynamics except to mention if there is an intonation problem.

Playing too loud is usually directed at the brass because they can easily overblow the woodwinds. This is true also of saxes if not careful.

You got a new conductor who appears to be bigger on balance. Sounds like your band is turning over a new leaf, better horizons ahead. I'd forget the past and move on.

We have a jewelry store out in one of the nearby suburbs that has a fairly decent choice of watch brands and they have their own event each Fall where they'll have brand representatives come to talk about their watches and they'll set up a tent for free oysters on the half shell and give out swag bags. My wife and I went last year and got a good look at the place and had a pretty good time. The highlight of the event is a sort of costume party, where you "dress to the nines" matching your favorite watch and you get to give a one minute spiel to win a prize. Last year that prize was a $3,200 Fortis watch, but they gave out plenty of other nice prizes as well. And this year? I'm gonna win one.

So put yourself in my place. Which of your watches would you go on about and what would you wear? Some of the costumes I saw last year were pretty impressive. One guy came as an airplane and for sure they'll be someone in an astronaut getup. My idea is a bit more simple and is geared to plug for this store I have absolutely no relationship with. I don't expect to win the top prize, but I should place. And yeah, I'm not telling at this point what I'm planning, but what would you guys do? If you dared:

A shop putting on free events is charging too much. imo

Colin the Bear said:

A shop putting on free events is charging too much. imo

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Well perhaps now, if it wasn't clear before, I should point out that I'll likely never buy a watch from these folks, or anything else for that matter; though I'll give them every opportunity while I'm there to convince me otherwise. I'm just scheming to win a prize, eat free oysters and take home swag. Plus, I get to see watches I'd always wanted to see. Like Norqain last year. I saw them and I hated them. Win-win.

I've come to realize that every watch I own, but for two somewhat frugal cruise expenditures, were purchased new at the lowest price I'd ever seen for what I bought; then and now. I ain't gonna be able to make such deals at a shop like this. But again... if I see something I'd like to buy, they will have every opportunity to sell it to me; but at my price, not theirs.

Grumps said:

I'm not telling at this point what I'm planning, but what would you guys do? If you dared:

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I’m guessing you’re going as a Nationals fan wearing a Ravens watch.
I would go as a Pig playing on C sax with high hopes to win a Seiko Metronome.

I believe Lee Allen used a double lip embouchure.

Direct Current said:

Finally, is DOUBLE LIPPER a term? Hopefully that won't get me barred.

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I haven't heard the term, but it's obvious what it means in the context of saxophone or clarinet playing so why not. I don't understand why it would get you barred though.

Pete Thomas said:

I haven't heard the term, but it's obvious what it means in the context of saxophone or clarinet playing so why not. I don't understand why it would get you barred though.

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Because I really appreciate you and the Cafe Pete Thomas and I'm never sure how something might be taken as naughty. Probably my mind is the problem. Thank you!

Direct Current said:

Because I really appreciate you and the Cafe Pete Thomas and I'm never sure how something might be taken as naughty. Probably my mind is the problem. Thank you!

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We don't bar people very often and certainly not without a conversation first 🙂

Jx

Hi all,

I'm currently reworking my set up, thanks for some health and DENTAL problems. All the above is helpful. Thanks