Beginner Saxes Arbiter pro sound... Taiwan.

[bill_reed]

just got myself a Arbiter pro sound sax, it stamped Taiwan and s/n 481296, someone said it was from about 1988 as it not stamped London... plays really well and I really like it a lot just wanting to know more about it as information seems very scarce...

 

[rhysonsax]

Welcome to the Caff @bill_reed .

I've got quite a collection of old saxophone-related catalogues and flyers that I have picked up on my travels round music shops.

I can't remember where I collected a couple of colour glossy Arbiter things. One is a catalogue from 1995, celebrating 50 years "since a young Ivor Arbiter learnt the trade from the back room of a shop [in Soho] specialising in the repair of brass and woodwind instruments." The alto models in the catalogue are the "superb value" SAS565GLS and the "top of the range" WWX520LQ, but no prices are given.

The other item is an undated A4 flyer for Arbiter Pro Sound "jazz collection custom colours" showing a range of finishes including red, white and black. It says "prices from £719.00 RRP inc. VAT".

If you are interested in seeing the catalogue and/or flyer then start a Private Conversation and I could scan them for you.

Rhys

 

[bill_reed]

Welcome to the Caff @bill_reed .

I've got quite a collection of old saxophone-related catalogues and flyers that I have picked up on my travels round music shops.

I can't remember where I collected a couple of colour glossy Arbiter things. One is a catalogue from 1995, celebrating 50 years "since a young Ivor Arbiter learnt the trade from the back room of a shop [in Soho] specialising in the repair of brass and woodwind instruments." The alto models in the catalogue are the "superb value" SAS565GLS and the "top of the range" WWX520LQ, but no prices are given.

The other item is an undated A4 flyer for Arbiter Pro Sound "jazz collection custom colours" showing a range of finishes including red, white and black. It says "prices from £719.00 RRP inc. VAT".

If you are interested in seeing the catalogue and/or flyer then start a Private Conversation and I could scan them for you.

Rhys

thank you Rhys for the information. that's great... will get in touch so i can get a scan... new to the forum so how do i start a private conversation... thanks again...

 

[bill_reed]

my Arbiter pro sound alto sax...

 

[Jeanette]

how do i start a private conversation... thanks again

Click on his name and then a box with start conversation should show

Jx

 

[tommoh]

Please forgive the thread resurrection...As a younger man I worked for Arbiter in their brass and woodwind department. I can tell you that the basic 'Pro Sound' saxes were pretty much anything but. They were fine as starter saxes go, pretty much bog standard in construction, made first in Taiwan, then China. The 'Jazz' models were a step up, made solely in Taiwan and the 'Jazz II' a step further still, double key arms etc. They were made in the same factory and to the same specs as other more expensive brands.
They are well worth getting if they're in good nick as the brand name puts people off and bargains can be had, in fact I have just bought one for a good price which will hopefully put my Grassi Alto into the eBay pile. Yes, this is partly nostalgia on my part but they were decent horns.
As an aside, while working there I also got to try possibly the world's worst sax, a demo model from a factory in Vietnam which played a semitone out Low C to middle C, I guess the wrong length neck, but it made for some fun 'Les Dawson' moments in the warehouse during lunch break.

 

[teen37]

Please forgive the thread resurrection...As a younger man I worked for Arbiter in their brass and woodwind department. I can tell you that the basic 'Pro Sound' saxes were pretty much anything but. They were fine as starter saxes go, pretty much bog standard in construction, made first in Taiwan, then China. The 'Jazz' models were a step up, made solely in Taiwan and the 'Jazz II' a step further still, double key arms etc. They were made in the same factory and to the same specs as other more expensive brands.
They are well worth getting if they're in good nick as the brand name puts people off and bargains can be had, in fact I have just bought one for a good price which will hopefully put my Grassi Alto into the eBay pile. Yes, this is partly nostalgia on my part but they were decent horns.
As an aside, while working there I also got to try possibly the world's worst sax, a demo model from a factory in Vietnam which played a semitone out Low C to middle C, I guess the wrong length neck, but it made for some fun 'Les Dawson' moments in the warehouse during lunch break.

Hi, and also sorry to ressurect an old thread but I've had an arbiter pro jazz tenor for quite a few years now. It's in as new condition as it was barely played when I bought it off eBay for £200. I've not played it loads myself tbh, but I've always thought it was just a cheap horn. Anyway, my question to you is, are they worth keeping and playing or should I just upgrade to something better. I'm not a beginner but my playing has been sporadic over the last few years simply through lack of motivation and no real reason to play as I'm no longer playing in bands 😢

 

[Stephen Howard]

Hi, and also sorry to ressurect an old thread but I've had an arbiter pro jazz tenor for quite a few years now. It's in as new condition as it was barely played when I bought it off eBay for £200. I've not played it loads myself tbh, but I've always thought it was just a cheap horn. Anyway, my question to you is, are they worth keeping and playing or should I just upgrade to something better. I'm not a beginner but my playing has been sporadic over the last few years simply through lack of motivation and no real reason to play as I'm no longer playing in bands 😢

As you're not a beginner then it really boils down to whether you like the sound you get out of it and how easy it is to play.
If it works fine and you like it - hang on to it and use it. If not, get shot.

They're not bad horns in general - and because it won't fetch much on resale it's probably worth hanging on to...if only as a spare.

If it hasn't been played in a while it would benefit from a service. Horns don't like to be left untouched for years...they sort of get a bit flabby.

 

[teen37]

As you're not a beginner then it really boils down to whether you like the sound you get out of it and how easy it is to play.
If it works fine and you like it - hang on to it and use it. If not, get shot.

They're not bad horns in general - and because it won't fetch much on resale it's probably worth hanging on to...if only as a spare.

If it hasn't been played in a while it would benefit from a service. Horns don't like to be left untouched for years...they sort of get a bit flabby.

Thanks Stephen. I have your Haynes manual for sax , it's very informative. It's not a bad sax really, I'm just not convinced it's worth persevering with. It was serviced a few years ago but I'm not inclined to pay whatever it is these days for another one when it can go towards a better instrument. I've been scouring your reviews on what to look at. The guy in Sax in London suggested an Eastman ets223. He said they were impressed with the tone, intonation and keywork and it's nods to the 52nd street model. Having noticed how many tenors fall into that price range is a little overwhelming. I'm always drawn in by the Getz sound, that husky, cozy, rainy day cafe sound for want of a better description. I'm just not sure how to determine which tenor will help me achieve that with my Otto link tone edge.

 

[Stephen Howard]

Thanks Stephen. I have your Haynes manual for sax , it's very informative. It's not a bad sax really, I'm just not convinced it's worth persevering with. It was serviced a few years ago but I'm not inclined to pay whatever it is these days for another one when it can go towards a better instrument. I've been scouring your reviews on what to look at. The guy in Sax in London suggested an Eastman ets223. He said they were impressed with the tone, intonation and keywork and it's nods to the 52nd street model. Having noticed how many tenors fall into that price range is a little overwhelming. I'm always drawn in by the Getz sound, that husky, cozy, rainy day cafe sound for want of a better description. I'm just not sure how to determine which tenor will help me achieve that with my Otto link tone edge.

The ETS223 comes in around the grand mark - and that's not a lot of money for a horn. I'd suggest that your existing Arbiter is worth persevering with until such times as you can run to something a bit pricier.
Also...relying on the horn to give you a particular sound (Getz et al) is a recipe for disappointment and/or bankruptcy.

OK, sure, getting a sultry Getz sound out of a YTS280 is going to require some hard work and dedication - but by the same token, throwing 5K at a horn and expecting Stan to pop out of the woodwork and offer to wash the dishes while you put your feet up is just as much a long shot.

For what you're looking for, and given your budget, the used market is going to yield the best results. An early Yanagisawa should be within range (800 series+) - and if you can tolerate a clunkier action then there are some nice-blowing vintage horns out there.
But the 223 strikes me as less of an upgrade and more of a side-step. But, as always, the proof is in the blowing.

 

[teen37]

The ETS223 comes in around the grand mark - and that's not a lot of money for a horn. I'd suggest that your existing Arbiter is worth persevering with until such times as you can run to something a bit pricier.
Also...relying on the horn to give you a particular sound (Getz et al) is a recipe for disappointment and/or bankruptcy.

OK, sure, getting a sultry Getz sound out of a YTS280 is going to require some hard work and dedication - but by the same token, throwing 5K at a horn and expecting Stan to pop out of the woodwork and offer to wash the dishes while you put your feet up is just as much a long shot.

For what you're looking for, and given your budget, the used market is going to yield the best results. An early Yanagisawa should be within range (800 series+) - and if you can tolerate a clunkier action then there are some nice-blowing vintage horns out there.
But the 223 strikes me as less of an upgrade and more of a side-step. But, as always, the proof is in the blowing.

Ah ok, I do appreciate your advice here Stephen, I've been playing for a long time but I'm very unsure about actually buying a decent used tenor when it comes to it as I just don't know enough about what to look for as they are so technical. As it happens I do realise that the Getz sound is mostly achieved through mouthpiece and reed choice not actually the horn. I want to upgrade mine for something with a warmer tone, better intonation and keywork and free blowing. I really don't trust myself with used horns but I'll certainly take a look at what's out there. I've never given Yanis a second thought as they are usually beyond my budget.

 

[Pete Thomas]

As it happens I do realise that the Getz sound is mostly achieved through mouthpiece and reed choice not actually the horn.

That’s not been my experience. I believe the largest part of achieving the “Getz sound” is mostly through practice.

 

[turf3]

Well, since Getz mostly recorded using a Selmer Mark 6 and a rubber Link or Brilhart Ebolin, I'd say pretty much any of the dozens of different Super Actin 80 copies floating around out there, and a rubber Link, or Brilhart Ebolin, would pretty much get you as close as equipment can get you.

Of course, you might find that you need something different than Stan needed, to get the Stan sound, because after all you're a different person. But a Selmer copy and a rubber Link or Brilhart, is such an extremely standard setup, that you can't go far wrong with it anyway.

 

[Pete Thomas]

and a rubber Link or Brilhart Ebolin,

And he tried to buy my metal Selmer but I wouldn’t sell it to him.

 

[teen37]

That’s not been my experience. I believe the largest part of achieving the “Getz sound” is mostly through practice.

Well of course practice certainly helps with most things huh , so I would agree 😉

 

[teen37]

Well, since Getz mostly recorded using a Selmer Mark 6 and a rubber Link or Brilhart Ebolin, I'd say pretty much any of the dozens of different Super Actin 80 copies floating around out there, and a rubber Link, or Brilhart Ebolin, would pretty much get you as close as equipment can get you.

Of course, you might find that you need something different than Stan needed, to get the Stan sound, because after all you're a different person. But a Selmer copy and a rubber Link or Brilhart, is such an extremely standard setup, that you can't go far wrong with it anyway.

You know, the more I'm looking the more confused I'm getting...😳🙄 It's going to be difficult to try out all the suggestions from you guys on used horns as they are not all local 🤷 and I've got an Otto link tone edge hr6 just last weekend 😉 along with a slightly harder reed, it certainly helps with the breathy subtones.....I'll keep practicing of course 😊

 

[teen37]

And he tried to buy my metal Selmer but I wouldn’t sell it to him.

😳🙄😂

 

[Tonehole]

I have been watching for one of these to pop up for resale.

https://tedklum.com/products/yardbird-model-brass-alto

Cheaper in Hard rubber.

https://tedklum.com/products/yardbird-model-hr-alto?_su_rec=n3-jHCDzbsQ5cGjMMBwPeiR_zySP9Mp048jGufI-SfVRq26wvCM8qsThjcRNNiaYloXBqHiAqcRPS4zSd6SgXk6cHT1EOP_7pb7ZKCgFH_r2AvIsQ2QHI4BvUGYh_KteeU0TPcwy3W60WDt-IVNdxepr6FcHaelzPVA96oD-vPhovTShyFviiyDf8njqPvn0PHbkOvxC_Rq0GaMJu25zcb2jql-H2VpbGYbdfg0x-IwA__1-TZL32s1JIsMSUvOzsgo6WazhopJ8AnOpzWp5zoj3zvUvgW95Kmkvx_LiJFbhLMLYcBGoTtEx727aeVTJL_GGCYJFBDaGjzTFiO5qmbbcr2U&_su_rec_id=d669dfef-4de2-4b93-aec2-f4bd1904c77b-1792021192

https://massullomusic.com/products/pre-owned-ted-klum-yardbird-8-alto-saxophone-mouthpiece

 

[Colin the Bear]

The time to buy a new horn is when you feel no confusion.

 

[JayeNM]

Ah ok, I do appreciate your advice here Stephen, I've been playing for a long time but I'm very unsure about actually buying a decent used tenor when it comes to it as I just don't know enough about what to look for as they are so technical. As it happens I do realise that the Getz sound is mostly achieved through mouthpiece and reed choice not actually the horn. I want to upgrade mine for something with a warmer tone, better intonation and keywork and free blowing. I really don't trust myself with used horns but I'll certainly take a look at what's out there. I've never given Yanis a second thought as they are usually beyond my budget.

You know, the more I'm looking the more confused I'm getting...😳🙄 It's going to be difficult to try out all the suggestions from you guys on used horns as they are not all local 🤷 and I've got an Otto link tone edge hr6 just last weekend 😉 along with a slightly harder reed, it certainly helps with the breathy subtones.....I'll keep practicing of course 😊

The issue here is, given your budget....a brand new horn which is firmly REALLY at the intermediate level ( this means tonality and blowing response are actually more dialed in, and ergos and key action are slicker and more responsive than base or budget models -just as a generalization) is probably going to cost more than your budget.
Which is why folks brought up the used market.

Now, I am no expert on new shop prices. Usually what I do is just go to Thomann and plug in some good, current models which I know and respect, to see what the absolute CHEAPEST price available would be...because they usually are the online purveyor that has such pricing.

Just did that... and for some makes and brands they did not come up with much as far as significant deals on intermediate or better models which land in your price range., and other models tgey simply do not have......except for the Jupiter 700. Which is just their updated 789 intermediate. THAT is a worthy contender, there, new for 1300quid on their UK site.

Some sites call it 'student', but I have worked on a couple and they really are the former 789 intermediate horn with just a few minor changes. Plus their current 'student' model is the 500, per the Jupe website...they list the 700 as intermediate. So that one is def a step up from any base model. Price pretty good too, on this side of the Pond the cheapest retail price I found was $2050 or 1550quid equiv.

So that one might be worth looking into. They are good models.