Beginner Saxes Unbranded Sax vs YTS-21 For Beginner

[JayeNM]

I feel like I've seen identical saxes to this one that cost $3000+, so I'm thinking maybe it's from the same factory in China as those but sold unbranded for the domestic market?

Ken, how are you concluding that. "Identical"...by what yardstick ? Because if one wants to make the argument that thru keen observation they have determined that THIS horn is in fact a ____________(insert fairly recognizable name brand here)...it has to do more than simply look like the ___________________.

Keyguards, shape of pinky table, bellbrace, neck key, finish....these are very poor barometers in determining whether sax A is the same as sax B. Not picking on you, because I will tell you as a repair person - I have had PLENTY of pro players come in all excited about their new XXX which is 'the same design as a _______________________ (insert your very reputed/popular brand/model sax here) !"...and usually withing 5 minutes I can find at least a half-dozen significant differences.

I even locked horns in the past with some very unscrupulous product reps who went so far as to market their horns as "clones" (their word) of the _______________________________ (insert classic Grail Horn make/model here)

......when in fact once I got one in my hands, it was clear that only a few aesthetic details were copied and the truly 'meaningful' aspects of the original horn's design/fabrication (neck and body tube specs, precision of key casting/mechanics, etc...) where nowhere to be found.

So yeah....first horn, limited budget: stay away from a new sax which costs under $500 because as the saying goes : "You Get What You Pay For".

Used Yama/Vito 21/23....a Jupiter....maybe a Buffet-Evette...maybe a Keilwerth ST90....these are known models and they have more going for them.

 

[JayeNM]

Tight budget is $750 max, but I was really hoping to spend no more than $500-650. I was considering the Yamaha at $1000 simply because it's the cheapest good brand (/ ANY known brand) I've been able to find so far. I'm in Alberta (Edmonton).

I was also looking at the Mendini ones on Amazon at $600-650, which seem to get 50/50 praise as great for the price or terrible as a tech's nightmare.

You ARE correct...a NEW model of GOOD REPUTE does in fact cost around $1300usd.

You can start getting into the boutique brands which have found their market niche in the $900usd-ish area.....and at least THERE, while reviews are mixed....they at least lean towards positive "for the $, not a bad horn" sort of conclusions (mind you I may not partcularly agree with some of those assessments myself, but I digress...)

So yeah, $600-750can ($550usd tops) STILL leaves you in a 'no-man's land' if your intention is buying NEW.

Mendini = no Cecilio = no

........ just don't go there

However, it is a FEASIBLE budget to get something used, and solid.

BTW...the Yamaha 21 i at $1000ca ($760usd) is a tad high, but not ridiculously so (as long as it is guaranteed to be in good, serviced playing shape with no significant body damage)

Lastly, yes when you are in a place where local shops and craigslist ads are limited, you are oftentimes left with no other option but to buy online. As long as you do some research and come up with a short list of models to look for, and make sure the seller a) has a return policy and b) guarantees the horn to be in good playable condition.....more often than not things turn out alright.

Maybe around 15% of my sales are to CA (my shop is in US), and even after you added in the customs fees and shipping, most buyers still came out well ahead of what they could have gotten had they shopped within a few hundred miles radius or so,

 

[JayeNM]

So...I am a bit flabbergasted...Edmonton is around 1 million population, yes ?....and Craigslist has zero saxes and only 17 musical instrument listings total...Kijiji has only around a dozen saxes listed (just 3 Tenors). Wow, for that size a municipality ?.......

You could contact the YTS-21 seller and see if he/she would accept a bit less, maybe offer $800-850cad - if you can swing it ? That would be a fair market value for that horn, if it plays (ad claims it does).

 

[KvltMart]

So...I am a bit flabbergasted...Edmonton is around 1 million population, yes ?....and Craigslist has zero saxes and only 17 musical instrument listings total...Kijiji has only around a dozen saxes listed (just 3 Tenors). Wow, for that size a municipality ?.......

You could contact the YTS-21 seller and see if he/she would accept a bit less, maybe offer $800-850cad - if you can swing it ? That would be a fair market value for that horn, if it plays (ad claims it does).

Ya, for whatever bizarre reason our classified sales here are starving. I play drums and guitar as well and the pickings for those are always almost non-existent and always seem to be the same few garbage models that are laughably over-priced and 10 years out of date.

I think I'm going to rent one for a few months just to verify that I appreciate playing saxophone as much as I do listening to it, then take a look again at what's available.

 

[thomsax]

I like YTS 21, 23 and 25. 23 and 25 is roughly the same horn. YTS 25 is with high F#.. The YTS-21 is IMO different.

I have some saxes that I use to lend. "The New King" (Keilwerth) -68", "Diamond" (Dörfler & Jörka) -63, "Vienna" (Keilwerth) -56, "The Indiana by Martin" -60 ...... . These saxes are better for me compared to Yamaha stident saxes. An less money as well.

For a year ago I bought a used (mint) G4M tenor (Yani copy). Bought it for 2500.00 s e k ( Can $ c 320.00). It's for sale now, for 2000,00 s e k (Can $ c 255.00). I bouhgt it because many other players were saying how great they are. They are good. Some of the saxes above are easier to work on if you are a DIY. But modern design of the keys (ergo) is better compared to old King, Conn Armstrong .... saxes.

A good G4M tenor and SH woodwind manual kcan be an alternative?

 

[Colin the Bear]

Oh! Hang on! You're a drummer. I thought we were advising a potential musician. 😉

 

[JayeNM]

I think I'm going to rent one for a few months just to verify that I appreciate playing saxophone as much as I do listening to it, then take a look again at what's available.

I guess that is probably a good plan given the dearth of local possibilities. Best of luck.

 

[jonf]

I have bought the most wonderful Vito branded yts-23 from you Jonf and the distance from where you live to Athens Greece .... is 2x or 3x ...... it was a pleasure 🙂 and certainly a bargain

Indeed, it's about 2,000 kilometres between us. I remember that sax well, it was a good one. Something like that would be ideal for the OP.

 

[bill_reed]

I got myself a cheep Ammoon soprano from amazon just a few weeks ago, I knew if it did not play out the box or had defects I could send it back as they give a 30 days return.... surprisingly it did play rather well out the box with only the two lower tone rods with excusive movement... I took off both keys and a little tap with my brass hammer on the upper posts I soon had taken away about 95% of the play... I have worked on clarinets for 30 years but this is my first Sap sax... now playing real good, cant fault it at all,,, again I only have my alto to compare but to me its sounds really good for just over £200... only thing I did do was buy a Rico mouthpiece as I like how the b5 sounded on my alto... compared to the stock mouthpiece the Rico is a more mellow sound.... still trying to find the right reeds and using rico plastic 2.0 at the moment but will probably change to legere like i use on the alto......

 

[Rob Pealing]

Hi folks,

After 16 years of wanting to start, finally looking to buy a horn, specifically a tenor.

I've got a pretty tight budget, so I was looking around on eBay and local classifieds. On eBay I found this nicely engraved, abalone key one:

100% New Professional Bb Matt Black Surface Black Key High F# Tenor Saxophone | eBay

Find many great new & used options and get the best deals for 100% New Professional Bb Matt Black Surface Black Key High F# Tenor Saxophone at the best online prices at eBay! Free shipping for many products!

www.ebay.ca

It's nice and cheap, but unbranded. I feel like I've seen identical saxes to this one that cost $3000+, so I'm thinking maybe it's from the same factory in China as those but sold unbranded for the domestic market?

There's also a used YTS-21 in my local classifieds for $1000 (Canadian). From what I understand, the YTS-21 is basically professional quality, made in Japan in the 70's to the same specs as Yamaha's top-end models but without fancy engravings/ features. But I also always see it touted as a student model, so that seems like a contradiction to me, and I'm not sure what the age and history of it is.

Thoughts? And does anyone here have any experience with the mystery sax? I really like the look of the unknown eBay one, and it's a few hundred bucks cheaper, but it is still an unknown (though if it's garbage, I think eBay's buyer protection may help me?).

Thank you in advance for your help!

- Ken

Hello, I do not know where you are in Canada ( I am in NS) I suggest you rent from Long and McQuade or somewhere similar for several months and go from there. After 3 to 6 months you will have a much better idea of things. In the meantime read all you can on the Cafe.

 

[Flatmasterflex]

I played sax roulette when I was living in Hong Kong. I bought a new "Selmer" Chinese alto for 105 GBP (180 Canadian) from the Amazon of China (Taobao.com). It plays great from what I can tell (I'm a total novice) and I have no regrets. However, I understand that I could have easily gotten a lemon. But for 100 pounds, I thought what the hell.

I recently borrowed my sister's old YTS-23, and there is very little noticeable difference in the quality of sound (to me). I'm using a Yamaha 4C mouthpiece with both.

 

[nigeld]

I played sax roulette when I was living in Hong Kong. I bought a new "Selmer" Chinese alto for 105 GBP (180 Canadian) from the Amazon of China (Taobao.com). It plays great from what I can tell (I'm a total novice) and I have no regrets. However, I understand that I could have easily gotten a lemon. But for 100 pounds, I thought what the hell.

I recently borrowed my sister's old YTS-23, and there is very little noticeable difference in the quality of sound (to me). I'm using a Yamaha 4C mouthpiece with both.

I think you were lucky, but there's no doubt that some cheap Chinese saxes are excellent. I have no idea what the percentage of good ones is. If it's 50%, then a £100 "bet" makes sense.

And getting a Yamaha 4C to replace the mouthpiece that came with the horn was a good idea.

I suspect though, that the Yamaha YTS-23 will still be going strong a lot longer than yours.

 

[Flatmasterflex]

I think you were lucky, but there's no doubt that some cheap Chinese saxes are excellent. I have no idea what the percentage of good ones is. If it's 50%, then a £100 "bet" makes sense.

And getting a Yamaha 4C to replace the mouthpiece that came with the horn was a good idea.

I suspect though, that the Yamaha YTS-23 will still be going strong a lot longer than yours.

I don't doubt that for a second. The YAS-23 (not T, it's an alto) is already 30+ years old and going strong.

 

[Colin the Bear]

Some Chinese saxophones are surprisingly good. Some are shockingly bad. There's no way to tell on the internet.

 

[Adrian63]

I'm lost again : the OP is a year old ; I think the thinking was whether to get a Yam or to take a punt on a cheap Chinese unbranded..?
Was a decision ever made and if so watcha get ?

 

[ghostler]

Some Chinese saxophones are surprisingly good. Some are shockingly bad. There's no way to tell on the internet.

Yes and no. One really needs to scrutinise the source, because everyone these days are trying to make a profit on their sales. a decade ago, I was looking for a soprano sax. One brand out of all the others had interestingly enough, good reviews. So, $219 later I bought me a Venus from an E-Bay vendor out of California, Musical Wheel. A decade later, I still use it. It plays like a good intermediate.

Lately, the seller has only a fraction that he used to advertise, so either he is slowly winding down business or maybe has found a more favourable web market to use.

But, you are correct. Regarding unbranded, Advertised on Amazon was a used in black nickel Mendini Tenor Sax, mentioned it had some dents but played okay, for only $200 US. It was their mainline seller for this instrument.

I took a stab at it. Instead, I received a hardly used alto in nickel. It had a few finger marks, easily wiped away with a dampened paper towel. It has absolutely no scratches in the finish, rest appears brand new, even the body and neck came wrapped in disposable foam cushion bags. The mouthpiece was tried but only a very faint sign of teeth marks on it, had to examine it close to notice. Plus it came with the usual white gloves (those I'd never use), reeds, electronic instrument tuner, neck strap, etc.

Just an informal "look - see" didn't notice anything to indicate if it is inferior. I'll know more when I "take it for a spin".

I could have complained as it is "not as advertised", but occasionally there is a student I know of in need of an instrument but his/her parents cannot afford. If it plays okay, then, may make a nice gift to such. So, I haven't filed for return yet. The black nickel is a more expensive option, and these saxes have been easily going for double the amount I paid even in plain clear lacquer finish. This is not even the cheaper painted black finish.

Fortunately, I know the mid school (6th - 8th grade) and high school (9th - 12th grade) band teachers, who also play occasionally in the community band. Can give them my assessment on the brand.

 

[ghostler]

Recently I had my Selmer Bundy II alto sax (approx. year 1984) serviced, cost me $151.12 US, but was worth it. Now it is a joy to play, would be IMO a good backup sax for a gigger, even a good starter sax if in good playable condition for a beginner, as today they can be had for under several hundred US dollars.

Yesterday I broke it out. Last touched a sax (tenor) during our Clovis Community Band concert in May. Tarpley's Music Store repairer in Lubbock, Texas did a really nice job, fixed a number of issues, now it is a joy to play.

Took it out for a spin on Chicago's Does Anyone Know What Time It Is?

https://soundcloud.com/ghostler81%2F2025-07-02-selmer-bundy-ii-alto-sax-does-anyone-know-time%2Fs-3gWwbm5LdRt

View: https://soundcloud.com/ghostler81/2025-07-02-selmer-bundy-ii-alto-sax-does-anyone-know-time/s-3gWwbm5LdRt?si=089f77b00f4a4b65a5d6021537cee75b&utm_source=clipboard&utm_medium=text&utm_campaign=social_sharing

Authorized further repairs, now waiting on my Le Blanc Vito tenor sax in about a week. Found it is a Yamaha YTS-23 stencil of the 1980's, looking forward to it being in my hands soon. Being a stencil, if one manages to find one in good condition, can be had for considerably less than as a name brand.

Regarding the new Mendini alto, gifted it to a high school son of a friend. He was overjoyed to receive it, know this will help him to advance in music as he currently plays trumpet but was interested in reed.