Two pads one tone hole.

[Vetinari]

On my Elkhart 300 culy sop the body octave key has 2 pads.The one that covers the tone hole has hole through the middle and another pad covers this. When the octave key is pressed the lower pad lifts the upper until reaches c# when the lower closes but leaves the upper open. This then stays open all the way to top F#. This does not exist on any of my other saxes. What is it for? The key is the one immediately under the front Ftouch.

 

[Vetinari]

Update. This key does not seem to be the body octave key and appears to be part of the B and Bis and lower, and only changes function on C# and up when the octave is pressed.

 

[Mark Hancock]

My Yanagisawa SWO1 straight soprano has something similar. I have wondered about it, so I'm interested to see what this is all about.

 

[nigeld]

My Bauhaus Walstein curly soprano has the same thing.

 

[jbtsax]

C#3 can be a notoriously sharp note on saxophones, especially sopranos. This is an ingenious way to lower the pitch of C# when the octave key is pressed by reducing the venting. That particular type of "donut key" is a pita to work on.

I added a "C bridge key" to a True Tone alto to do essentially the same thing by raising the "back bar" on the upper stack and lowering the C pad the desired amount.

I made it "detachable" so the player can remove it if desired. The only drawback to this design is that it requires bending in order to adjust the opening. Curt Altarac has designed an adjustable one that is more "sophisticated" that he calls "Clyde the Glyde". Unfortunately pictures of it are no longer available on his website

 

[kevgermany]

Good explanation Jbtsax. I'll just add that some vintage saxes have this on other keys. Not sure why, though.

 

[Vetinari]

Ahh! The happy world of soprano. Thanks JBT. Nice to know that I'm not the only one who did not Know about this.

 

[jbtsax]

Good explanation Jbtsax. I'll just add that some vintage saxes have this on other keys. Not sure why, though.

You might be referring to this type of "piggy back" key that is on my Evette-Sheaffer Buffet Crampon soprano sax. Rather than a key to adjust intonation, it is an alternate way to trill D to Eb. The 2nd finger on the RH can also close the D key allowing the 3rd finger to open and close the small key on top of the D. You will notice in the photograph the added keys of the "modified Apogee" system that allows the middle finger to play low Bb, B, and C# with the right hand.

 

[Mark Hancock]

Both of my sopranos have this feature, but the Yani has what looks like some kind of synthetic pad for the "main" one.

 

[peterpick]

the selmer 26 has a double pad system for the d key (sounding f (alto), three fingers of the right hand). so does an extraordinary couesnon alto i just got. it's difficult, how you'd replace the pad with the hole in the middle i do not know. rupert noble shook his head and said 'not a good solution'. i noticed this on my yanagisawa soprano too.

 

[Vetinari]

Wonder what @Stephen Howard would say if he was asked to fix one of thess keys......

 

[Stephen Howard]

Wonder what @Stephen Howard would say if he was asked to fix one of thess keys......

I've done lots of them, they're no particular problem.

 

[Colin the Bear]

Stick a polo mint in the cup. Sorted

 

[Vetinari]

I've done lots of them, they're no particular problem.

Thought that there would have been lots of..
*!?**__×#@ involved in the answer.

 

[Stephen Howard]

The small 'doughnuts' can be fiddly - but the trick is to use a cork or synthetic pad rather than a leather one.
The trill D is just your ordinary pad with a suitable hole punched in it and set in the normal fashion.
I suppose the trickiest aspect is punching the hole precisely in the centre of the pad - and if you're uncertain as to whether you can do it by eye it only takes a couple of minutes to knock up a basic punch guide out of a lump of wood or plastic.

 

[kevgermany]

Stick a polo mint in the cup. Sorted

You like hard pads and a cracking sound!

 

[nigeld]

Stick a polo mint in the cup. Sorted

So that's what people mean when they described a horn as "minty".

But surely the mint will gradually dissolve, and the horn will need a regular re-mint.

 

[griff136]

You might be referring to this type of "piggy back" key that is on my Evette-Sheaffer Buffet Crampon soprano sax. Rather than a key to adjust intonation, it is an alternate way to trill D to Eb. The 2nd finger on the RH can also close the D key allowing the 3rd finger to open and close the small key on top of the D. You will notice in the photograph the added keys of the "modified Apogee" system that allows the middle finger to play low Bb, B, and C# with the right hand.

View attachment 15199

The Pupeschi system - seen on some Selmer Paris horns from the 20's/30/s

 

[jbtsax]

The Pupeschi system - seen on some Selmer Paris horns from the 20's/30/s

Thank you for that information. I had not heard of the Pupeschi system until now. I tried looking for more information and all I could find is that it is some type of "articulated" key work. I also found that the patent to the key design on my soprano was granted to Paul Evette in 1899.