Saxophones Soprano - curiosity.....

[LisaP2026]

Currently learning alto but thinking about hiring a sop just to see what it's like but have a couple of questions.....

1) is sop more difficult to play than an alto?

2) have heard that they are more prone to going out of tune - is this the case?

3) would you recommend a straight or a curvie to try?

Or would you suggest sticking with the alto until more competent......?

 

[LostCircuits]

There's an Ammoon straight sop coming up for auction next week - only 1 photo but looks in good nick. Worth a punt or steer clear?

Google Search

 

[LisaP2026]

I guess that suggests staying well away from this brand.....?

 

[Tuppertn]

I guess that suggests staying well away from this brand.....?

Quality control on instruments at this level is essentially non-existent. You might get a good one, you might not. A good one will be playable but will likely need frequent adjustment. A bad one will ruin your soprano experience.

I'm thinkin' you get maybe a 50/50 shot.

 

[Dr G]

Quality control on instruments at this level is essentially non-existent. You might get a good one, you might not. A good one will be playable but will likely need frequent adjustment. A bad one will ruin your soprano experience.

I'm thinkin' you get maybe a 50/50 shot.

A horn that will need frequent adjustment is mediocre.

I call the odds at getting a good horn as far lower than you suggest. Why not just invest in the lottery, then buy a good horn with your winnings?

 

[Tuppertn]

A horn that will need frequent adjustment is mediocre.

Yeah, that was supposed to be my point. I wasn't clear enough.

A good Ammoon is, at best, a mediocre horn.

 

[LisaP2026]

Why not just invest in the lottery, then buy a good horn with your winnings?

I do!! But all I ever get is a lucky dip which ain't gonna get me anywhere....!

Aaarrrgggh!

 

[PigSquealer]

Reputedly....I dunno if this has ever been confirmed, tho, has it ? The only two confirmations would be
1) Dave Kessler has said so, written so
2) Someone had both in front of them and measured 'em up. Or had both cross their workbench at different times and measured both up then compared.

I have looked for some post or online statement regarding 1). Haven't looked very hard, but have looked. Cannot find one...(which makes some sense, a store brand stencil would not generally publicly reveal its mother factory).

While you’re looking compare a Wilmington or Narayan too.

 

[Stephen Howard]

I do!! But all I ever get is a lucky dip which ain't gonna get me anywhere....!

Aaarrrgggh!

I know you're trying to do this on the cheap - but there's cheap...and there's too cheap.
Unless you're lucky enough to know someone who's selling a cheap soprano, and you have the opportunity to try it out and maybe take it to a repairer for a checkover - your best bet is to buy a new one from Gear4Music. If what turns up is dreadful you can just send it back and get another one. If it works, you're sorted for now.
You'll still likely need to have it fettled...but that holds true even for horns that cost rather more.

 

[thomsax]

A Yanagisawa S6 stencil from the 70's can be really bargains.

 

[LostCircuits]

Just as an example of what you would be looking at with a cheap Chinese instrument:

This is from the octave mechanism of a Mendini. The slot is not at a right angle through the arm but at a roughly 20 degree angle and to compensate they made it just wider. And yes, I fixed it but only because it was for a friend. And I should have taken a picture of the original mpc. It was bad enough to frighten little children.

 

[progger]

So, one reason to stay away from soprano at first... it costs a bit of money to get one that will be worth it. Get at least a Yamaha 475, I would say, to avoid setup, sealing, and maintenance nightmares.

There are still so, so, so many good used saxophones floating around out there, I can't imagine buying the Temu special just because it's cheap. (And I've literally never bought a new saxophone, not a single time in my life.) Get something used and decent.

 

[JayeNM]

I do.

I don't....I don't believe in taking it out on customers just because i gotta wiggle my fingers a bit more to get rods and screws in and out...especially when a curvy soprano is so relatively rare that it makes up maybe 5% of the horns that come thru. If that....

Way I figure it, servicing 10 straightforward Conns, Bundys, Yamahas, Jupes lickety-split makes up for me having to spend an extra hour or so on a curvy.

But moreover, for posterity sake, I am writing this to dispel a potential myth that some future reader might start to lean towards along the lines of "Don't buy a curvy, buy a straight, because curvies are more expensive to service".

That would be an unfortunate and false parameter for one to add to to their list of considerations.

 

[JayeNM]

Just as an example of what you would be looking at with a cheap Chinese instrument:

View attachment 33928

This is from the octave mechanism of a Mendini. The slot is not at a right angle through the arm but at a roughly 20 degree angle and to compensate they made it just wider. And yes, I fixed it but only because it was for a friend. And I should have taken a picture of the original mpc. It was bad enough to frighten little children.

Another Mendini story: a friend in Oregon started working for a rural school district, the district FOOLISHLY bought a band room worth of Cecilios and Mendinis from some unscrupulous 21st century peddler obviously. His friend, also mine, was a tech in Portland.

After 3 years of use, 50% of the instruments were irreparable , and had to be dumped . More accurately, to have repaired them back would have costed 2x what the district budget allowed for instrument servicing.

I saw the lot, myself...and yeah...it was BAD. I mean, bad.

 

[PigSquealer]

Anyone have thoughts on maybe trying a Yamaha Venova ?

Yamaha

Yamaha Main

www.amazon.com

 

[LisaP2026]

So, one reason to stay away from soprano at first... it costs a bit of money to get one that will be worth it. Get at least a Yamaha 475, I would say, to avoid setup, sealing, and maintenance nightmares.

There are still so, so, so many good used saxophones floating around out there, I can't imagine buying the Temu special just because it's cheap. (And I've literally never bought a new saxophone, not a single time in my life.) Get something used and decent.

Not sure where you got the idea it was a Temu special? The actual listing is from a West of England auction house (An Ammoon Soprano Saxophone, in red with gold trim and in fitted case.)

Even I wouldn't be so daft as to consider buying one from Temu............! Ebay or Amazon maybe but definitely not Temu.....

I know you're trying to do this on the cheap - but there's cheap...and there's too cheap.
Unless you're lucky enough to know someone who's selling a cheap soprano, and you have the opportunity to try it out and maybe take it to a repairer for a checkover - your best bet is to buy a new one from Gear4Music. If what turns up is dreadful you can just send it back and get another one. If it works, you're sorted for now.
You'll still likely need to have it fettled...but that holds true even for horns that cost rather more.

And yes, @Stephen Howard - I am trying to do this on the cheap....mainly because I'm not very good on the alto yet so don't want to spend (and potentially waste) a chunk of money on something that I might not enjoy or be able to play.

Probably best for me to concentrate solely on the alto until I can make some progress and then possibly look to hire a sop to try out?

 

[LostCircuits]

Another Mendini story: a friend in Oregon started working for a rural school district, the district FOOLISHLY bought a band room worth of Cecilios and Mendinis from some unscrupulous 21st century peddler obviously. His friend, also mine, was a tech in Portland.

After 3 years of use, 50% of the instruments were irreparable , and had to be dumped . More accurately, to have repaired them back would have costed 2x what the district budget allowed for instrument servicing.

I saw the lot, myself...and yeah...it was BAD. I mean, bad.

I was laughing about your post but it was more like gallows humor. But yeah, I wasn't kidding when I wrote earlier that it appeared that instead of having a mill, they had a few rodents, which bit out the slots instead of cutting.

In this particular case, I got the horn into decent playing condition without too much effort but it was one of these things where you had to know exactly what to look for in the maze of manufacturing misfits.

 

[LostCircuits]

Not sure where you got the idea it was a Temu special? The actual listing is from a West of England auction house (An Ammoon Soprano Saxophone, in red with gold trim and in fitted case.)

Even I wouldn't be so daft as to consider buying one from Temu............! Ebay or Amazon maybe but definitely not Temu.....


And yes, @Stephen Howard - I am trying to do this on the cheap....mainly because I'm not very good on the alto yet so don't want to spend (and potentially waste) a chunk of money on something that I might not enjoy or be able to play.

Probably best for me to concentrate solely on the alto until I can make some progress and then possibly look to hire a sop to try out?

Alto and soprano are very, very different instruments. Yes, you can learn some of the basics on alto and then transpose to soprano but they will still be very different beasts.

My point is, don't get discouraged, if you like soprano, go for it and don't wait for your alto skills to mature, you just learn bad habits. Tenor, that would be different.

😀​

 

[Stephen Howard]

Way I figure it, servicing 10 straightforward Conns, Bundys, Yamahas, Jupes lickety-split makes up for me having to spend an extra hour or so on a curvy.

But moreover, for posterity sake, I am writing this to dispel a potential myth that some future reader might start to lean towards along the lines of "Don't buy a curvy, buy a straight, because curvies are more expensive to service".

So you spend 'an extra hour or so' servicing a curved soprano which, apparently, aren't any harder to service than a straight one.

OK.

 

[Stephen Howard]

And yes, @Stephen Howard - I am trying to do this on the cheap....mainly because I'm not very good on the alto yet so don't want to spend (and potentially waste) a chunk of money on something that I might not enjoy or be able to play.

Probably best for me to concentrate solely on the alto until I can make some progress and then possibly look to hire a sop to try out?

I would say that's a sensible bet. Put it on the back-burner for a while and maybe something will come up in the meantime. And you might have a bit more dosh to throw at the project. Perhaps keep an eye on ebay in case a suitable candidate turns up in your area - in which case you can nip round and have a look at it.

 

[turf3]

There is absolutely no reason a straight soprano will play better in tune than a curved one, given equivalent quality of design.

For that matter, when your right thumb starts to give out and the thing starts to droop down like a clarinet, the change in embouchure can affect intonation.

Personally, I believe that there are essentially zero saxophones made since 1915 or so, from name manufacturers, that are inherently out of tune, when in good operating condition, used with a mouthpiece of appropriate design, and played by an experienced musician who's spent the time to become familiar with the instrument.

Of course it's not fair to compare the intonation tendencies of an instrument designed in 1915 and made in 1920 to those of one designed in 1990 and made last year. They'll have different wonky notes and be designed for different types of mouthpieces.