Saxophones Soprano - curiosity.....

[LisaP2026]

Currently learning alto but thinking about hiring a sop just to see what it's like but have a couple of questions.....

1) is sop more difficult to play than an alto?

2) have heard that they are more prone to going out of tune - is this the case?

3) would you recommend a straight or a curvie to try?

Or would you suggest sticking with the alto until more competent......?

 

[Ivan]

These buggers are small and tedious things to work on

That is saying something from someone who will repair, adjust, mend, clean, bore, turn, scrape, polish, shave, thread, bend, grind, pack, stick, swedge, grease or jigger almost any other mechanism without complaint

 

[PigSquealer]

That is saying something from someone who will repair, adjust, mend, clean, bore, turn, scrape, polish, shave, thread, bend, grind, pack, stick, swedge, grease or jigger almost any other mechanism without complaint

Yeah, small and tedious is why I gave up watch repair when I stumbled across a sax at a yard sale. The parts were bigger and I could see them without a surgeon's loop. Working on a curved SOP reminds me of working on a ladies 12mm movement. One with 0,49 x 0,49 screws over a cloth. Loosing a screw in the white cloth😤.
A 40mm is like working on a baritone. Lots of room.

 

[Dr G]

b) Steve Howard says that the straights are easier to work on and he will know.

Get a good one then.

 

[LostCircuits]

b) Steve Howard says that the straights are easier to work on and he will know.

I second this comment even with my limited SOP repair experience. These buggers are small and tedious things to work on.

I don't believe everything Steve Howard says. Ok, I believe some of it but not everything.

And no I have worked on at least a dozen sopranos and probably the easiest one to work on was the Curved Borgani, the most difficult one (by a large margin) was the King Saxello.

Ok, I take back the Borgani, It was the easiest but it had this leak that I couldn't figure out until I found the pinhole in the middle of the inside of the bow. Easy fix with a droplet of nail polish, though.

The hardest sopranos to work on - and it is not just sopranos - are the ones that had been worked on by incompetent techs and where 80% of the repair effort goes into unrepairing botched work. And some Mendinis/Cellinis/Professioanls etc. where the parts look like they used rodents instead of machines to cut them.

 

[PigSquealer]

I don't believe everything Steve Howard says. Ok, I believe some of it but not everything.

And no I have worked on at least a dozen sopranos and probably the easiest one to work on was the Curved Borgani, the most difficult one (by a large margin) was the King Saxello.

Ok, I take back the Borgani, It was the easiest but it had this leak that I couldn't figure out until I found the pinhole in the middle of the inside of the bow. Easy fix with a droplet of nail polish, though.

The hardest sopranos to work on - and it is not just sopranos - are the ones that had been worked on by incompetent techs and where 80% of the repair effort goes into unrepairing botched work. And some Mendinis/Cellinis/Professioanls etc. where the parts look like they used rodents instead of machines to cut them.

Says the PhD brain surgeon.
Yeah, you have an extreme ability to service any SOP. I wouldn’t be surprised that you fall asleep setting an upper stack that would have me on fire. You probably find this relaxing compared to nano technology surgery or testing bionic implants.
I’m just a plumber who doesn’t want any leaks or a flush handle that sticks 🤪

 

[SuperAction80]

The cheapest and decent straight sopranos are the Vietnamese made Kesslers and mid tear Chateaus. Both have higher quality horns made in Taiwan. You can hold out for a used Yanagisawa or Yamaha, both which are made to amazing spec, but will probably require an overhaul.

A cheap Chinese horn is a shot in the dark, and while you can certainly cut your teeth on one, it will ultimately cause more headaches than what you'd experience with a better made horn. And that's taking into consideration the extra money you'd spend having a shop attempt to iron out its deficiencies.

The used Conns and Bueschers are excellent horns, once you get past the antiquated keywork. The pearls are rather tiny, but they do sound good in the mid range. It's the lack of that high F# key and occasionally the front F that make them a headache, especially if you're doubling. Great horns, but with limits. If you have the time to learn them, they may work for you.

 

[thomsax]

1. No. Just different.

2. I don't think so. A soprano can be out of tune but often it's the soprano player that is out of tune. I don't play trad Rock & Roll Saxophone on a soprano. I think it's important to have ideas what and how to play the soprano sax. Just want to add; I'm a terrible soprano player but it doesn't stop me.

3. I'm a straight guy. I have 4 straight sopranos. The oldest is from 1924 and the youngest is from mid 50's. The old school soprano design/tradition. All of them keyed from high F to low Bb, darker more mellow tone, and all of them responce best with a "classic" designed mouthpiece. I use a Selmer Classic "D" metal mpc on sopranos. The Dukoff D-6 is resting. I have just owned one curved soprano. An italian stencil engraved with "Rex" on the bell. I didn't liked it and traded it for some boxes of tenor reeds (un-used) and a SM 57 microphone ..... .

4.

more competent......?

I think you are very competent. You already formulates clever questions/reflections ........ .

 

[LisaP2026]

4.

I think you are very competent. You already formulates clever questions/reflections ........ .

Thanks - my questions might be clever ....not so sure about my playing ability though! Currently best described as "squeaky goose" I think....!

 

[Ballymenaboy]

I have a straight Bahaus that I enjoy playing except for the fact that it puts a strain on r/h thumb join after playing for a while

 

[EdJ]

Why would the curvy demand a hunched position? If the mouthpiece is too low, raise the neck strap.

I’m 6’4” on a good day, and stand tall when I play a curved sop. I also stand upright to play flute. I find it important to always keep an open airway. Stand up straight and bring the mouthpiece to your face regardless of instrument.

It’s the arms / shoulders that I think could potentially find themselves in an awkward position. Hunched is the wrong word as that applies to the back but I can’t think of the right one. I am happy with my curved sop ergonomics for me my arms are very bent cf alto / tenor / bari where they become progressively straighter with size but I try to ensure they are hanging relaxed so it is fine. Initially I think my shoulders were tense until I realised it and rectified it.

You are quite right about position for all instrumentalists. Stand straight bring the saxophone to your mouth and get someone to check your posture every now and then to ensure you are not allowing yourself to lean forward / crane the neck forward. I learned that as I had neck / thoracic spine problems contributed to by a rugby injury, cycling posture and saxophone posture .

I tend to point it out to instrumentalists I play with (pianists also commonly suffer from postural problems)

Posture is Very important for long term neck / shoulder / back protection.

 

[Wonko]

The used Conns and Bueschers are excellent horns, once you get past the antiquated keywork. The pearls are rather tiny, but they do sound good in the mid range. It's the lack of that high F# key and occasionally the front F that make them a headache, especially if you're doubling. Great horns, but with limits. If you have the time to learn them, they may work for you.

Last year I got myself a Rampone & Cazzani curved sop. It has a vintage-like sound and more modern ergonomics.
It's my first soprano and I like it. My teacher tried it, and he said it is a great/cool soprano (it's hard to find the right translation for "toffe sopraan"). Since he is somewhat sceptical of anything that isn't Selmer or Yanigasawa, I find that a strong recommendation.

 

[Stephen Howard]

I don't believe everything Steve Howard says. Ok, I believe some of it but not everything.

And no I have worked on at least a dozen sopranos and probably the easiest one to work on was the Curved Borgani, the most difficult one (by a large margin) was the King Saxello.

In terms of general servicing there’s not a great deal in it – though it’s pretty much always the case that it’s easier to dismantle the lower stack on a straight without having to pull the bell keys off...and you’re more likely to encounter ‘gotchas’ on a curvy than on a straight.
That’s based on a rather large sample size.

Where it really diverges is when a sop gets dropped- which they do, surprisingly often considering their size.
Take, say, the spectacularly common Yanagisawa 901 – in the straight and the curved options – and then drop them both.
You can go straight in with the tooling on the straight and get everything sorted. The curvy is a bell-off job, plus you have the extra work of getting the bell correctly realigned on reassembly. And stoved-in soprano bottom bows are always such fun to work on...

 

[LostCircuits]

Yes, if you're talking major body work, I agree 100%.
My comments were regarding overhaul, minor repairs.

 

[LostCircuits]

It’s the arms / shoulders that I think could potentially find themselves in an awkward position. Hunched is the wrong word as that applies to the back but I can’t think of the right one. I am happy with my curved sop ergonomics for me my arms are very bent cf alto / tenor / bari where they become progressively straighter with size but I try to ensure they are hanging relaxed so it is fine. Initially I think my shoulders were tense until I realised it and rectified it.

You are quite right about position for all instrumentalists. Stand straight bring the saxophone to your mouth and get someone to check your posture every now and then to ensure you are not allowing yourself to lean forward / crane the neck forward. I learned that as I had neck / thoracic spine problems contributed to by a rugby injury, cycling posture and saxophone posture .

I tend to point it out to instrumentalists I play with (pianists also commonly suffer from postural problems)

Posture is Very important for long term neck / shoulder / back protection.

The T-Rex was never known for a hunched position if that's what you refer to. 😉

 

[progger]

All saxophones are perfectly in tune or horrifically out of tune, depending on the player... 🙂 Yes, I'd agree that soprano is more sensitive in that regard, but you cannot get away with "poke-and-pray" on alto and tenor and play in tune. Those ears have to be working, all the time.

I think OP should feel free to focus on soprano of that's the favorite sound. The more time you spend on it, the easier it gets. For some reason, I found it easier to get a good sound on soprano earlier than alto or tenor.

 

[PigSquealer]

The cheapest and decent straight sopranos are the Vietnamese made Kesslers and mid tear Chateaus.

Both are Château. Kessler orderers them just not 100% sealing & regulated. That the choose to do in-house. And the reason they play well.

 

[JayeNM]

I second this comment even with my limited SOP repair experience. These buggers are small and tedious things to work on.

Might have an element of truth but...not like a tech would charge more for servicing one than a straight, really..

 

[JayeNM]

Both are Château. Kessler orderers them just not 100% sealing & regulated. That the choose to do in-house. And the reason they play well.

Reputedly....I dunno if this has ever been confirmed, tho, has it ? The only two confirmations would be
1) Dave Kessler has said so, written so
2) Someone had both in front of them and measured 'em up. Or had both cross their workbench at different times and measured both up then compared.

I have looked for some post or online statement regarding 1). Haven't looked very hard, but have looked. Cannot find one...(which makes some sense, a store brand stencil would not generally publicly reveal its mother factory).

 

[Stephen Howard]

Might have an element of truth but...not like a tech would charge more for servicing one than a straight, really..

I do.

 

[LisaP2026]

There's an Ammoon straight sop coming up for auction next week - only 1 photo but looks in good nick. Worth a punt or steer clear?