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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Simon" data-source="post: 615884" data-attributes="member: 1571">Hi MartinI learnt the relationships of notes by repeated singing n listening n working at a keyboard (away from the sax). The keyboard gives me a point of reference in terms of harmony, I can get 4 octaves easily and I'm a visual type learner so the keyboard layout helps me to memorise the sound I hear. I haven't found that playing a sax gets me anywhere near this.Scale theory is exactly that - theoretical. Example - I got taught that over a iim7b5-V7b9-imM7 progression you should use a harmonic minor based on the imM7 chord. The sound of the b9 over the iim7b5? Hmmm. I found other sounds that I liked and used this for a while. Years later I learnt these were called harmonic majors, a semitone apart. Big deal.I don't know if harmony is the late comer. I've always learnt that there are 3 aspects to music, but for me rhythm has the edge!  Slonimsky's book? Hmmm, would be great if it had some tunes in it; never have been asked to play the 'Heptatonic Arpeggio Blues' or the 'Sesquiquadritone Progression Shuffle' ;-)I'm certain Michael Brecker did practise scales. For about a month, maybe two just to knock those diminished runs into shape. Then for the rest of the time he listened to others, copied solos, played tunes, created patterns and composed while developing an amazing sound on tenor and ewi and had alot of fun in the process.Hearing the degrees of the scale and relating them in a harmonic context is the ultimate aim, but I've found that if I work on ear training and singing intervals in different harmonic contexts, I can get pretty close to identifying them on the horn. I tried the 'this is the #11 sound in a minor chord' idea, but it's too slow. Because learning sounds with labels attached kinda leads you down this path. Labels help explain it in hindsight to someone else, but for me they just slowed me down and made playing tunes and improvising stressful. Charlie Parker apparently once said, "when you're on the bandstand, leave the theory at home."I tell my pupils to practise as if they were actually performing to an audience. If in your practice sessions you're trying to play with the same good sound and play as well as you would like when on the stage, why would you do the mental gymnastics then too?I agree there are basics you need to have down, especially the mechanics of playing. I disagree that you should devote time to scale practice because there are 100s of tunes to learn and the musical chops you'll build by putting in the time and 'paying dues' AND the enjoyment you'll get from it far outweighs the technically impressive and (I found) dull, lumbering practice of scale running. Also, as a member of the audience it's really obvious when a player has drilled scales - it's almost like you can hear the pages turning as s/he moves from one chorus to the next. As a member of a band, will the others care what scales you know or what tunes you can play? If you have the ability and confidence to play by ear, surely your personality on the bandstand would reflect this too, and make the whole experience more enjoyable for the rest of the band and more importantly the audience.So once again Hannah - learn 'Happy Birthday' starting on G!Simon</blockquote>