Beginner impro G7/A and A7/C#

[Pete Thomas]

I went back to the beginning of the chord rather than continuing up the A scale - A B C# D E F# G# - 1 3 5 b7 - A C# E G

Here’s a tip: instead of thinking scale of A (with b7) think of scale of D ( major or harmonic minor).

EDIT: unless it is a blues and the A7 is chord I

 

[JayeNM]

Maybe just a technicality, but the A is the 9th of the G7 chord. I agree it's a bit strange to put it as the bass note since I always thing of it as on 'top' of the G7 chord. But I guess it could be placed anywhere in a voicing. As a horn player, I don't worry about those notes below the slash in a slash chord.

Correct, proper nomenclature is 9th, not 2nd....only in secret bassist language would we call it that (but lead players aren't supposed to know of the existence of this.... )

 

[JayeNM]

This isn’t my understanding. My understanding is what Colin said: the bass player is instructed to play those notes as the roots of the chord. Any other rhythm section player is free to voice the chord as sounds best (unless there is no bass player and the piano is covering that).

Further, the guitarist always has to be very mindful of his voicings as it’s very easy to clash with the piano. In this case, “full” chords will seldom be played by the guitarist. I think guitarists call them “shell” voicings - maybe 3-note voicings that can be used for several chords.

Probably so, yes...the only instance where a piano or guit would voice that is if there is no bass player at all (duo, for example).
You are right though, in a combo setting which inludes bass + chord +lead, the chord player wouldn't do that as they assume the bass is gonna. Most all of of the time.

 

[JayeNM]

Right, got it.
Don't want to overcomplicate things, ignore the slash will do for now.
Thanks all

I'd still be interested in seeing the sheet music where that G7/A is happening, tho....

 

[JayeNM]

Yes it’s a 9th, I’ve never heard it called a 2nd.

Dammit, the Royal Order of the Secret Bassist Cabal is gonna hunt me down now for letting that one slip out....😳

 

[lydian]

I'd still be interested in seeing the sheet music where that G7/A is happening, tho....

Surely you know the tune. Just sing the bridge and you'll hear the ascending bass line over the G7.

 

[cappers]

I'd still be interested in seeing the sheet music where that G7/A is happening, tho....

Post #11
Beginner theory - G7/A and A7/C#

 

[Pete Thomas]

Surely you know the tune. Just sing the bridge and you'll hear the ascending bass line over the G7

I wasn’t aware the original had the bass line playing the melody.

Post #11
Beginner theory - G7/A and A7/C#
View attachment 31242

I believe that is an unusual arrangement, not officially published sheet music which I don’t think has G7/A. I won’t call it wrong, just not something I would do 🙂

 

[JSL]

Correct, proper nomenclature is 9th, not 2nd....only in secret bassist language would we call it that (but lead players aren't supposed to know of the existence of this.... )

Well, it's no secret. Certainly, everyone who refers to the '9' in a chord also knows it's the same note as the '2' of the chord root. But because a chord is defined as a stack of 3rds, there is no '2'. As mysterious as that sounds, it's totally logical when you understand how a chord is constructed.

The same can be said for the 11 & 13. They are the same notes as the 4 & 6 in relation to the root. But as chord tones, they are the 11 & 13. It's not as complicated as it looks when written out. And, once again, the important thing is to get the sound of all those chord tones (and their altered versions) in your mind. Then you can call it, in your own mind, whatever you want.

 

[JSL]

Speaking of Honeysuckle Rose, wasn't that the tune that the drummer (I think was Jo Jones?) threw a cymbal at Charlie Parker, in his 'development stage', when he was trying to play a solo?

 

[GCinCT]

Speaking of Honeysuckle Rose, wasn't that the tune that the drummer (I think was Jo Jones?) threw a cymbal at Charlie Parker, in his 'development stage', when he was trying to play a solo?

I think Honeysuckle Rose was the only tune he knew and they were playing Body and Soul. There’s also the story that he got lost playing rhythm changes.

 

[GCinCT]

On a personal note, Honeysuckle Rose is the first tune I ever improvised on.

 

[Colin the Bear]

Slash chords are handy when arranging in BiaB to make the bass go a certain way. Ascending, descending or pedal.

When watching guitar or piano parts they are ignored.

 

[cappers]

I believe that is an unusual arrangement, not officially published sheet music which I don’t think has G7/A. I won’t call it wrong, just not something I would do

I have no idea where the arrangement came from. I don't think it's one of the current band leader's, it doesn't look like his other's style and format wise.

There was previous B/L who left (with relief to all apparently), it may be his.
Sometime ago I posted an arrangement of Green Onions that raised some eyebrows, maybe the same arranger?

 

[Pete Thomas]

who left (with relief to all apparently),

I’m not surprised if he wrote G7/A. IMO it’s just wrong in that context and probably in any context.

 

[Colin the Bear]

I’m not surprised if he wrote G7/A. IMO it’s just wrong in that context and probably in any context.

No wrong notes. Just interesting harmonies. 😁

 

[Pete Effamy]

I’m not surprised if he wrote G7/A. IMO it’s just wrong in that context and probably in any context.

I think it’s more likely that the arranger wanted an A11 or Asus sound - but it makes little sense there. G11 or Gsus would make more sense if that sound was wanted rather then just a straight dominant.

In terms of slash chords an F/G - F triad with G in the bass has the feel of a Gsus or G11.

 

[skeller047]

In terms of slash chords an F/G - F triad with G in the bass has the feel of a Gsus or G11.

Or Dm7/G…. All function the same way, the sound of a subdominant chord over the root of the dominant.

This stuff takes time and experience to learn. As a soloist I would approach the following chords the same way:
F/G
Gsus
G7sus4
Dm7/G

G11 I might play differently, since it by definition does have the 3rd of the chord in it. I would probably just listen to what the rhythm section was doing, and respond appropriately. Which I would be doing in any case…

 

[lydian]

I wasn’t aware the original had the bass line playing the melody.


I believe that is an unusual arrangement, not officially published sheet music which I don’t think has G7/A. I won’t call it wrong, just not something I would do 🙂

Hal Leonard Real Dixieland Book has the slash chords.

 

[JayeNM]

Surely you know the tune. Just sing the bridge and you'll hear the ascending bass line over the G7.

I have played it too many times, just as I noted in an earlier reply, none of the charts I have used for it has a slash chord instructing a 9 in those areas/bars....seems a bit of a strange thing to me to have bass play 9 in those spots. It doesn't sound great, really....kinda clunky.....