Saxophone beginners Why top teeth on mouthpiece?

[Juju_Birdie]

Can anyone tell me why my top teeth need to rest on the mouth piece? I'm sure it sounds better if I don't.

i do have a reasonable underbite. My teeth don't meet . Would that make a difference?

 

[saxyjt]

Are you using a mouthpiece patch? It's in my opinion indispensable to isolate you teeth from the vibrations and avoid grinding into the mouthpiece...

If you don't rest your top teeth on the mouthpiece then how do you do? Float the mouthpiece between your lips or do you have your upper lip between the top teeth and the mouthpiece?

Floating would most likely be inconsistent and tiring...

 

[Juju_Birdie]

I think the second one. But it seems I really need to persevere with the teeth thing,

 

[Greg Strange]

Some people did use what is called the "double lip embouchure" where the top lip and not the teeth rest on the mouthpiece. I believe British classical saxophonist John Harle is an exponent of this method. Maybe forum member Dave Roach can confirm this...I think there was article in the magazine for the Clarinet and Saxophone Society of Great Britain about this...

I use the teeth on top method with a mouthpiece patch as advised about...

Greg S.

 

[Targa]

Simple answer is they don't have to if you feel you play better without doing it.
Or I've been doing it wrong for years.

 

[GCinCT]

i do have a reasonable underbite. My teeth don't meet . Would that make a difference?

I have a pretty severe underbite myself and it has not been a problem. What is does is put my bottom lip farther out on the reed which, I believe is one of the reasons my tone tends to be bright. Your embouchure needs to feel comfortable to you. We all have different physiology, yet we have all the potential to play well.

 

[Saxodent]

John Coltrane used a double embouchure which many tried to copy.
But he did it for one reason .
All his top teeth were loose and it was too painful to put any pressure on them.
A mouthpiece patch does make the position more stable and reduces vibration especially on metal mouthpieces .
Although teeth are not essential if you have developed the the supporting oral musculature properly

 

[jbtsax]

Advanced players can use any embouchure they like that works for them. The double lip embouchure is not recommended for beginning players due to the extreme muscular control it requires. Larry Teal in "The Art of Saxophone Playing" writes:

"The top teeth should rest on the point of the mouthpiece about 1/2 inch from the tip. This anchor point should be firm enough so that there is no problem of the teeth slipping on the mouthpiece. The weight of the head should rest here."

I started playing the saxophone 62 years ago and I still remember how uncomfortable it was to feel the vibrations from the mouthpiece through my top teeth. However, that quickly went away. I encouraged all my saxophone and clarinet students to use a thick mouthpiece patch at first for two reasons. First it eliminated that uncomfortable sensation, and second I could put an indentation in the patch with my thumbnail where the top teeth should go. Having the student put the mouthpiece in the mouth the same distance every time goes a long way to developing consistency in tone production.

 

[Colin the Bear]

We are all different. Your physiognomy, and hence you sound, is unique to you.

Vive la difference. 😉

 

[Pete Effamy]

The double lip embouchure was well-used many decades ago. Not so much now. Many (me too) think that it gives a better tone as it further opens the oral cavity. I haven't and wouldn't use it though and neither would I recommend it.
Having said that, a student came to me in college who played like this and wanted to be a classical player. Whilst it worried me - and I told her - I couldn't find fault with her usage of it - it isn't our job as teachers to make clones of ourselves. She went on to a Royal Conservatoire in London and her Prof was quite nasty about it and insisted that she change it. She is now a successful pro player.
I have to add that the amount of work she put in whilst at music college would no doubt have got her to where she is anyway - I'll ask her next time we hook up...

 

[Juju_Birdie]

Thank you for all your replies. I'll carry on working at it and also try 'my way" and talk about it with my teacher next week.

 

[fabriziodalisera]

@Juju_Birdie Hi, you don't have to bite! Applying a pressure on the mouthpiece is extremely negative to the sound. The only function on your teeth is preventing movements of the mouthpiece while you are playing. You should do it keeping a loose approach without biting, it takes time of course.
@Pete Effamy yes, double lip is interesting and very flexible soundwise. Some of great players from the past like Stan Getz, Ben Webster, Coltrane used it with excellent results. It is exremely difficult on clarinet, because of the absence of the neckstrap. I use a strandard embouchure, but lately I'm trying to use double embouchure 10 minutes a day and see what happens in the future....

 

[Doktat]

While I admire the advice from many who suggest you find what works best for you, I still haven’t seen the answer to her original question which was WHY the top teeth should rest on the mouthpiece. What is the reason the rigid professors would make you conform this ?

I am learning tenor after playing alto and the low C and downward are nearly impossible for me unless I go to what appears to be (from the discussion here) a “double embouchure.”

 

[GCinCT]

While I admire the advice from many who suggest you find what works best for you, I still haven’t seen the answer to her original question which was WHY the top teeth should rest on the mouthpiece. What is the reason the rigid professors would make you conform this ?

I am learning tenor after playing alto and the low C and downward are nearly impossible for me unless I go to what appears to be (from the discussion here) a “double embouchure.”

Without support at the top, the mouthpiece would not be secure in the mouth and playing well would be extremely difficult. The top teeth don't have to touch the mouthpiece. A double lip embouchure can be used. But there would still be support on the top. The double lip is not common among saxophone players, but if it works for you, then use it.