Playing the saxophone Playing 'in time'

[SLoB]

Just to put my oar in here.

When playing for your own pleasure timing is very much up to you. If you are the band leader or the soloist playing freely to the backing of a band or CD, etc the timing is up to you, but there will be key points you need to learn to hit (depending on the piece, etc, etc).

It is good to play unrestrained, but it is also important to learn to play in time.

For most of us we will more often than not be in the band/orchestra, etc backing someone else and in that situation you must be able to play in time with everyone else. As others have said it is down to practice with a metronome, with a CD, etc so that you learn timing.

However, the mistake most of us make (and I still do it often with new pieces) is to think about timing as we hit the beat. If you hear the metronome or see the beat and then play you are late and out of time. Timing is all about learning to anticipate the beat and therefore the timing.

If you are about to tongue a note as the beat arrives you will be late. Your tongue must leave the reed a fraction before the beat for the sound to be on the beat. I do not know if you saw the series about the choir when they went to Verona and split into groups and tried singing. If they listened to each other they were out. If they sang according to watching and anticipating the beat they were in time. It is all about sound delay, etc. Sorry if I am boring you.

The end result is that to get timing right you need to be aware that the sound coming out of the end of the sax is fractionally later than you tonguing it. You need to realise that when you tongue if you wait to see the batton drop or the metronome beat you will be late (our reactions are not that quick!!). Therefore timing has to be a matter of anticipation. This only comes about by practice and MOST importantly - playing with others. this is by far the best way to learn about timing. Join a band or Orchestra or some group of friends and simply play. You will soon learn about timing then - or else it will be a rather mushy cacophone of sound.

Hope these thoughts are useful.

Stephen

 

[Pee Dee]

BTW, the dots only came first in half of Mr Morse's code. The dashes come first in the rest. The letters and numbers are in mirror pairs too (eg A= .- N= -.). And before anyone asks what that has to do with rhythm, Morse code is very rhythmic in it's own way, even in a musical sense - remember Barrington Phelong's haunting theme to the Morse detective series that is built on the rhythm of the word M-O-R-S-E in code.

Only slightly off topic I hope!
Colin

Glad you brought up the Morse code angle Col. My teacher tells me I have excellent timing, which makes it easier to teach me. It must be down to my Navy training in Morse, and typing to music. I've also been complimented on my Morse, hand key of course!:welldone
So comparison between Morse and notes very relevant; dot length, note length - crotchet length, quaver length etc

 

[old git]

You two Hams have raised further questions.

Which requires better timing a standard or paddle key?

Which type helps your sight reading the most? 🙂

 

[Young Col]

Well apparently I've got reasonable music timing as well PeteDee, but I can't recall what came first in my youth, music or Morse training. Perhaps the rhythmic feel is an innate thing.

Bill the thing about using a paddle (a device for operating an electronic Morse keyer for the uninitiated) is that it is a bit like a drum machine. It's pre- programmed so that you get the exact right proportion of dash to dot lengths. 3:1 is the accepted ratio. In my transmitter there is a software menu that lets you change the weighting over the range 4:1 to 2.5:1 but I've never used it. Electronic keyers are probably OK for long converstions or contests as they give less strain on your forearm/wrist (so called telegraphist's glass arm). You have to be proficient enough not to let the dots or dashes run away with you and produce meaningless strings of either.

On the other hand learning manually - and professionally like Pete - you do learn correctly. Once proficient you start to develop your own "fist". Difficult to describe but it's just a slight micro shift of length or spacing that is you. Rather like in music you start to put your own slight inflections on things; it's like the difference between Willie Smith and Johnny Hodges - sam einstrument, same era, but recognisably different. You can put some soul in it!
Colin

 

[old git]

Serves me right. Ask a silly question.............................

 

[half diminished]

OK, well another great lesson (on Saturday). We've slowed down my playing and we're really focusing on timing. Seems to be working and just about got 'My Little Suede Shoes' nailed! I'm now revisiting the other tunes I can play to get some improvement.

Karen has also recommended a Lennie Niehaus book - which I already have. Looks interesting for Jazz articulation - something else I find difficult! 🙁

There have been some interesting (and inflammatory) comments - thanks.