Playing the saxophone Playing In Extremely High Volume Situations

[altissimo]

You should advertise them on the noticeboard, our members might attend 🙂Jx

Come back to Brighton sir!

we tried, but couldn't find a promoter interested enough to reply to our messages - maybe next year as part of our spring offensive..

 

[Jules]

we tried, but couldn't find a promoter interested enough to reply to our messages - maybe next year as part of our spring offensive..

Spirit of Gravity & Safehouse are the 'organizations' who are involved in the free scene down here... Can give you appropriate contacts when needed

 

[thomsax]

I just blow as hard as I can. And often I don't hear myself. A monitor helps up but not always. I went to a jam the other week and I played some songs with guys I've nerver played with before. I didn't hear the guitar or the bass so well. But I heard the drummer. It's small small place and the stage is also small. The drummer (a former hard rock drummer aus Berlin) played a big drumkit with double bass drums and many cymbals. I was nealy standing in his cymbals..I blew into a SM57 and the sax it 's a YTS 25 with Rovner #10 mpc with #4 plasticcovers reeds. The F# key had bad action but it's now better after a service. Tuff to play on jams like this, but it's fun. 3 solos from the jam.
DeadAudiolink Removed

 

[Ivan]

. Tuff to play on jams like this, but it's fun. 3 solos from the jam.

Fantastic growling sax @thomsax. It is great to hear you

I'm schadenfreude glad you're having the same auditory issues as me and, as I understand it, any other saxophonist who plays with louder others

But...your tones are audible.... somebody looked after you in the mix... which makes me jealous

Please post more...

Your recording is the sort of thing the veggie @Veggie Dave has specifically asked for, as per a.n.other post

 

[Dave E]

Playing with Dark Side of the Wall is a real treat nowadays. We always use pro sound engineers and the on stage levels are great although the out front rig is any where between 10 and 40k depending on the venue.
On stage levels are kept low, even the lead guitar is on a tight reign! We each have our own monitor and separate mix too. This means that I only need myself, keys, vocal and bass in mine as I stand next to the lead guitarist and I can hear him from his amp.
I don't like IEM becaus that means you have to trust someone else not to fill your head with feedback!
I have tried using earplugs and I bought some from Alpine. They have a filter system that helps to regulate how much noise filters through. The upside of them is that if you block out most of the other noise, you will hear your sax from inside your head as it resonates through your skull. The down side is judging your own volume.
I will have to listen to your soundclip later as I'm on holiday and forgot my headphones

Hi Taz - I just wondered if you’re still using Alpine earplugs. I played a gig last night (reggae and ska) where I play quite a lot of riffs on the hoof. Normally that’s ok but the fold back monitor was too far away, and the overall band volume too high, for me to hear all of my notes. I use a sound lab reflector which helps, but not enough. I couldn’t get on with IEMs when I tried those. Any comments?

 

[Veggie Dave]

I couldn’t get on with IEMs when I tried those. Any comments?

Either the band turns down/goes over to modellers, you have your own mic and monitor set-up or you learn to use IEMs.

 

[Nick Wyver]

I’ve been doing this for the last decade or two.

 

[Dave E]

Presumably that’s your own personal micro-monitor on the stand with input from a sax mic with its own power supply or using power back from the monitor

 

[Nick Wyver]

Presumably that’s your own personal micro-monitor on the stand with input from a sax mic with its own power supply or using power back from the monitor

Yes. Mic goes into effects pedal. From there to speaker on stand and from there to PA desk.

 

[Taz]

Hi Taz - I just wondered if you’re still using Alpine earplugs. I played a gig last night (reggae and ska) where I play quite a lot of riffs on the hoof. Normally that’s ok but the fold back monitor was too far away, and the overall band volume too high, for me to hear all of my notes. I use a sound lab reflector which helps, but not enough. I couldn’t get on with IEMs when I tried those. Any comments?

Hi Dave, a lot has happened since I wrote that. I'm still with Dark Side but I'm an enthusiastic advocate for IEM's now. After a couple of years with DSOTW, I realised that my hearing was starting to suffer. Tinnitus mainly. Hi volumes were hurting so I took the leap of faith and built a portable mic and monitor system. There's a bit more detail here. I still use the alpines during sound check when I'm not near the stage. If I'm not using them I just keep my IEM's in. In the end I settled for Shure SE215 ear buds with some custom moulds from Snugs

Misc electronics - My new stage setup.

After reading @Veggie Dave’s post on ear plugs, I thought I’d share with you, my latest stage set up. I’ve been searching for a simple solution to the old “mic & monitor” issue that those of us that gig suffer from. If you play with a loud band you may find yourself struggling to hear yourself...

cafesaxophone.com

 

[John Laughter]

Just curious, are you all hearing yourself in the mains? Do you know if your sound (solos) is reaching the audience/dancers?

 

[Nick Wyver]

Do you know if your sound (solos) is reaching the audience/dancers?

It depends a lot on the venue. In small venues you can usually tell but in the bigger ones it’s not at all obvious. Even if you have an out front sound engineer you can’t expect them to take any notice of the sax player because mostly, they don’t. I play in a band where the lead singer is also a harmonica player. Typically, if there is a sound engineer, his solos are considerably louder than the rest of the band. If I have a solo it’s usually inaudible. Of course you have no idea at the time. You only find out if someone has recorded it. Sour grapes? Yes. 😂

 

[John Laughter]

If I have a solo it’s usually inaudible

Likewise Nick. I was just wondering with all the discussion these days on floor monitors, personal PAs, in ear electronics, plastic reflecting sound shields attached to the bell, and small hot spot monitors on a stand next to the ear if some of us are being ignored on the balance in the mains.

 

[Pete Effamy]

It depends a lot on the venue. In small venues you can usually tell but in the bigger ones it’s not at all obvious. Even if you have an out front sound engineer you can’t expect them to take any notice of the sax player because mostly, they don’t. I play in a band where the lead singer is also a harmonica player. Typically, if there is a sound engineer, his solos are considerably louder than the rest of the band. If I have a solo it’s usually inaudible. Of course you have no idea at the time. You only find out if someone has recorded it. Sour grapes? Yes. 😂

So would these be sound engineers for a venue, or your own guy? Can you not give a list along the lines of:
Song 1 solos: gtr, keys, sax
Song 2 ….

Otherwise it’s just finger in the air and the engineer might still be preoccupied with sorting problems out. Or just being incapable of seeing and hearing.

 

[Veggie Dave]

Otherwise it’s just finger in the air and the engineer might still be preoccupied with sorting problems out. Or just being incapable of seeing and hearing.

I remember playing Chinnery's in Southend (a small but well known live venue) and the backing singer next to me desperately trying to get the sound engineer's attention every solo because he'd muted it and then forgotten I even existed.

 

[Pete Effamy]

I remember playing Chinnery's in Southend (a small but well known live venue) and the backing singer next to me desperately trying to get the sound engineer's attention every solo because he'd muted it and then forgotten I even existed.

Incompetence then

 

[Nick Wyver]

Incompetence then

I think that probably sums it up.

 

[Ghr9204]

I think that probably sums it up.

Back in the 1970's, most our band sound equipment was tube (valve) based. Maybe I'm wrong, but we had a knowledge called, "common sense". So, maybe not perfect but sound system was reasonably balanced with what limited staff we had.

"CS" was knowledge that everyone had that guided them in making the right moves when faced with unknown / new situations.

Today IMO in US at least it seems we have lost our way.

 

[Taz]

Just curious, are you all hearing yourself in the mains? Do you know if your sound (solos) is reaching the audience/dancers?

I suppose I'm very lucky as I play in a very professional band. Our sound engineer knows the show very well although occasionally we do use inhouse guys. My sound is set at a level during the sound check and the out front sound is normally incredible! In my IEM's I hear exactly what I want, at some shows I can use my ipad, through an app called "DLive 4 You" and set it up myself, using what looks like a mixing desk, I can add or remove any other instrument as I want (an enormous pleasure!!!) Because we use the same engineer, he simply saves the setup for each venue on his mixing desk. It takes us about an hour to set the sound and get a decent sound check done.
We had a gig professionally recoded 3 years ago. If you like a bit of Pink Floyd, here's a link. Please feel free to leave a comment (as long as it's nice

View: https://youtu.be/-4rTKCAFENU?si=jJ5WcAKLxzmkwe5J

 

[John Laughter]

I suppose I'm very lucky as I play in a very professional band

Pete you are indeed very fortunate! Awesome band and excellent music and balance. What can I say

I met Scott Page a few years ago when he was on tour with them. Then again last year. And very fortunate to have him on the book cover.

You take care and keep it going!! Thanks for the post.