Playing the saxophone Snobbery over certain standards

[mark_addy]

I've often wondered what would happen if you went to a typical jazz standards type jam session and called for Pink Panther theme or Pennsylvabia 65000. Bot tunes I used to pay on actual jazz gigs with my quintet (as opposed to jam sessions) from time to time.

Both of those appear in our big band pad, along with the James Bond theme, Summertime...loads of it. (Actually, the Summertime arrangement isn't a bad one - some nice things going on). My Dad is 83, and is one of the last people I know still upright who was too old to be a teenager (once teenagers were invented along with the Beatles, Stones and rebellion?), having gone straight to work at 15 to be a man, learn ballroom dancing and listen to jazz. Most of the audience for things I might really like to have a go at are under the ground, and unless our band plays stuff the general public is into, we'll never find anywhere to play! I don't mind mixing a bit of film music up with Glen Miller and a few actual standards (GfI, Besame Mucho both also appear). It helps that our musical director and band leader choose good arrangements and help us manage to more-or-less play them.

 

[skeller047]

Evidently the girl became famous. The Wikipedia article does not imply any bad behavior on the part of the composers. And Vinicius was a bit of a player, marrying 9 times. Desire and action are two different things.

The Girl from Ipanema - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Targa]

Both of those appear in our big band pad, along with the James Bond theme, Summertime...loads of it. (Actually, the Summertime arrangement isn't a bad one - some nice things going on). My Dad is 83, and is one of the last people I know still upright who was too old to be a teenager (once teenagers were invented along with the Beatles, Stones and rebellion?), having gone straight to work at 15 to be a man, learn ballroom dancing and listen to jazz. Most of the audience for things I might really like to have a go at are under the ground, and unless our band plays stuff the general public is into, we'll never find anywhere to play! I don't mind mixing a bit of film music up with Glen Miller and a few actual standards (GfI, Besame Mucho both also appear). It helps that our musical director and band leader choose good arrangements and help us manage to more-or-less play them.

I think you are a bit out, teenager was used in the ‘20s and certainly common by the ‘50s.
Your father could have been a ‘teddy boy’.

 

[Zasterz]

Evidently the girl became famous. The Wikipedia article does not imply any bad behavior on the part of the composers. And Vinicius was a bit of a player, marrying 9 times. Desire and action are two different things.

The Girl from Ipanema - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

It’s outmoded behavior for a reason:

 

[Dr G]

If this upsets you, please don’t look at the current fashion trends on the red carpet.

It’s all so confusing. “Don’t look at me.” “Oh, look at me!” “Guess what I’m wearing.” “Oh, look. I’m not wearing anything.”

 

[Targa]

Once you start looking for 'objectionable' lyrics you can find them anywhere.
Britney Spears prancing round as a school girl, Hit me Baby one more time.
I'll make a man of anyone of you, from Oh What a Lovely war.
And as for the reason Rolf Harris wanted that kangaroo tied down.....

 

[Colin the Bear]

Wasn't Carlos horrified by the English lyric?

No cat calling involved just teenage angst. longing and silent worship from afar. Unrequited love was a theme back then. Wasn't Stan having an affair with his missis?

Even without the lyrics, it's still a fascinating piece of music.

 

[cappers]

Wasn't Carlos horrified by the English lyric?

No cat calling involved just teenage angst. longing and silent worship from afar. Unrequited love was a theme back then. Wasn't Stan having an affair with his missis?

Even without the lyrics, it's still a fascinating piece of music.

Like Colin I think GFI is more about unrequited love and a love of beauty rather than the lustings of dirty old men. The lyrics imply they are sighing, not catcalling and leering. Sure there is some objectification of a young woman's body but many other popular songs are in a similar vein. It's Latin from the 50s, going to be a bit spicy! Still a lovely tune.

Same for Oye Como Va containing that chorus with an offensive term for a woman of mixed race.

Frank Zappa and Dyna-Moe Humm?

 

[Dr G]

Like Colin I think GFI is more about unrequited love and a love of beauty rather than the lustings of dirty old men. The lyrics imply they are sighing, not catcalling and leering. Sure there is some objectification of a young woman's body but many other popular songs are in a similar vein. It's Latin from the 50s, going to be a bit spicy! Still a lovely tune.

Same for Oye Como Va containing that chorus with an offensive term for a woman of mixed race.

Frank Zappa and Dyna-Moe Humm?

Ah, Frank…

Do you recall the album “Two Hundred Motels”?

“Half a dozen…

 

[Grumps]

Oh good... we're policing lyrics. Reminds me of when my father wouldn't let us play Darktown Strutters' Ball anymore. That one hurt.

 

[mrblackbat]

I've often wondered what would happen if you went to a typical jazz standards type jam session and called for Pink Panther theme or Pennsylvabia 65000. Bot tunes I used to pay on actual jazz gigs with my quintet (as opposed to jam sessions) from time to time.

Both are more associated with big bands than small combos though. And much of what make the tunes great (well I'm using that term loosely for Pennsylvania) are the arrangements rather than merely the tunes themselves; and they really need rehearsing to sound right - Pink Panther doesn't sound right without the brass parts being played.

 

[Alex]

С тех пор как я присоединился к этому замечательному сайту, я обнаружил, что здесь довольно много негатива по отношению к некоторым стандартам, таким как Girl from Ipanema, All of Me, Fly me to the Moon и т. д.

Вот что я хотел бы выяснить:

Не нравятся ли такие мелодии слушателям, которые слышали эти прекрасные мелодии в плохом исполнении, или же они не нравятся самим исполнителям?

Лично я считаю, что некоторые из упомянутых мелодий довольно сложно хорошо исполнить (особенно «Ипанема»), и испытываю огромное уважение к господину Жобиму за создание такой последовательности аккордов.

Это не значит, что мне не нравятся более эзотерические мелодии. Я просто не понимаю, осмелюсь сказать, ненависти к таким искусно созданным композициям.

М-м-м...

Мне нравится слушать латиноамериканскую музыку.

 

[Zasterz]

Oh good... we're policing lyrics.

Yes, policing is when I realize I don’t like something and stop wanting to play it. This has put the song in jail as it were. 😏

 

[Grumps]

Whether or not I like something has nothing to do with whether or not I'll play it. If my audience likes it, I'll play it. I hate all sorts of music. Wouldn't be fair to deprive people of it, I suppose.

 

[mrblackbat]

Poor you.

I do my best not to play stuff I don't like. Life's too short.

 

[Grumps]

Poor you.

I do my best not to play stuff I don't like. Life's too short.

If it's a job, you treat it like one.

 

[Zasterz]

If it's a job, you treat it like one.

Personally if I’m going to do something I don’t like for money, I can think of more lucrative fields. I’m sorry your job is in a music dungeon playing music you hate. Maybe consider law school?

 

[Grumps]

Personally if I’m going to do something I don’t like for money, I can think of more lucrative fields. I’m sorry your job is in a music dungeon playing music you hate. Maybe consider law school?

I like playing; just not every song I might have to play. If I'm with a working band, you definitely should choose music for your audience or you won't be working for long. Way back when, I didn't like dixieland music, but was never going to play music with my father otherwise as that's all he played. Take two or three chord rock songs. How was I going to meet girls playing rock & roll, if I didn't have to numb my mind to yet another twelve bar blues. I do like to perform; even if it's playing a song I don't favor. That's just maturity... or so I thought. I actually try not to be a music snob.

Oh, and I graduated law school in 1988.

 

[mrblackbat]

If it's a job, you treat it like one.

Which is why I stopped playing music as a job.

But then, my job now I still don't do stuff I don't like doing - life is too short.

 

[mrblackbat]

I like playing; just not every song I might have to play. If I'm with a working band, you definitely should choose music for your audience or you won't be working for long. Way back when, I didn't like dixieland music, but was never going to play music with my father otherwise as that's all he played. Take two or three chord rock songs. How was I going to meet girls playing rock & roll, if I didn't have to numb my mind to yet another twelve bar blues. I do like to perform; even if it's playing a song I don't favor. That's just maturity... or so I thought. I actually try not to be a music snob.

Maturity or not, personally, I find that the distaste for the music comes across in the music, and so it's not a great experience for the people who want to listen to that stuff. As an audience member it's better to have someone playing who's enjoying what they're playing. If you like what they're playing too, all the better.