Introduction Greetings

[pgboyd]

Communication can be difficult, I was curious if the other side of the octave mechanism looked like that on an Olds Super saxophone.

Here are other images of the octave mech including the front. I’m still in the process of finishing padding and spring installation. Springs are a lot harder to get right than I anticipated. Luckily I have a similar era stencil horn that I can refer to when I get stuck (no pun intended).

 

[Woodpad]

It is a unique construction, different from the Olds super and the German Hammerschmidt horse shoe octave mechanisms. The roller on the middle section is unique.

 

[PigSquealer]

For reference here’s an Olds.

And a Hammerschmidt tenor #061

Make it work is all that matters.

 

[PigSquealer]

I did have a chance to find your case refurbishment post earlier this week and read through quite a bit but not all of it yet. I started by taking some videos and photos as I disassembled the case that came with the 1923 EBIC alto sax. The case was in pretty sad shape so I knew early on that I would not be able to save it without some major work.

I took lots of measurements of the existing case and pulled the interior rot out of the way to look at the fasteners. Nearly all of the case hardware uses split leg rivets (two different sizes - smaller on the top and bottom where the corner protectors are connected). They also used clinch nails similar to an escutcheon nail rather than split leg rivets in some of the corner protectors.

Just about every sax case of that era that I've seen had a missing, repaired or replaced handle. I ended up finding a source on eBay that sells a nice leather handle that is connected using a shackle horseshoe D-ring (usually used on purses and handbags). Rather than removing the shackle from the horseshoe (very similar to a hinge rod) I ended up re-using the handle mounting brackets when I rebuilt the case. It was a big chore removing all of the original hardware from the case - lots of fun digging out the split leg rivets as I'm sure you have already experienced. The original wood was probably salvageable, but very mildewed and damaged from some mystery liquid. I ended up just building a new box with 1/2 inch plywood for sides and 1/4 inch pressed wood for the top and bottom. Believe it or not, the original top and bottom was a very similar 1/4 inch pressed wood to what I got at the big box store. The interior of the case was not padded very much, and what was there looked to be something similar to carpet pad (chatGPT tells me it was likely some type of horse hair based fiber).

The original case covering is likely more closely matched as something like bookbinders cloth - that or maybe a black oil painted canvas covering. I went with black Tolex and it turned out pretty well. I found out the hard way that the additional thickness of the Tolex made the closures on the front of the case slightly offset just enough that it doesn't close that well. I re-used the steel band around the top of the lid and with the extra layer of Tolex wrapped around it, it probably sticks out an extra 3-4 mm - just enough to make it difficult to close.

Like you, I quickly learned that too much foam padding made the case difficult to close. I ended up re-doing the interior multiple times until I found a combination I liked. I ended up using 3M spray adhesive and contact cement to mount the velour fabric to a hard foam called EVA Craft Foam. I used 10 mm foam on the bottom of the case, with Tite-Foam sprayed on top of that with the saxophone wrapped in clear plastic. The velour was then mounted over the two foams and then glued to the bottom. I also discovered that wrapping a 2 mm EVA craft foam with the velour worked great for the insides of the case - an added benefit is that you can make a long strip and cut it in half with scissors after covering it and speed up the wrapping and gluing process slightly. The storage box inside the case seems easy, but I learned that you want to wait to put it into the case until you have the holes drilled for the ribbon that holds the top of the storage case from opening too far. If not, you'll need something like a flex shaft to drill that hole. You also don't want to drill the holes for the ribbon with the velour fabric already glued down - it made a nice twisty mess that I had to repair.

Things I would do differently:

1. Don't use the steel band around the top of the case. Looks good, but throws everything off.
2. Make the case a closed box and then cut it in half on the table saw - lots of YouTube videos show this method and it probably results in a much better fit.
3. Make the case at least an inch larger in all dimensions than the original - you will want the extra space for padding.
4. Don't use pop-rivets - I thought it would be fine, but it protrudes about 1/4 inch inside the case and looks bad.
5. Don't worry too much about fitment of the Tolex - the corner protectors cover the edges and hide any small flaws.
6. Don't worry about re-using the original hardware - it's not easy to find, but there are lots of good sources that I found including Gerstner's for handles, corner protection, duckbill latches, etc. The locking mechanism isn't easily found but likely not necessary. I spent a lot of time with a dremel polishing off the existing hardware after spending way too much time removing old split-leg rivets and clinch nails. Next time I will remove the hardware without worrying as much about trying to keep the old wood, or just use new hardware altogether.

All in all, I probably spent 20-30 hours on this project and easily wasted $100-$200 on materials that I ended up not liking and not using. The fabric for the interior is one of those things that I ended up trying probably 6 different vendors before I found one on Amazon I liked. It still is not a great match - I was hoping for something like a short nap faux fur, but the crushed velour I ended up with was a good color and reasonably good feel. A little too stretchy and doesn't really stick down to the inside of the case where the sax fits into the Tite-Foam/Foam core, but it will have to do.

I have several other cases I plan to build in the next few months including one with a brown faux Alligator Tolex that I'm eager to start when the weather improves. Trying to use spray adhesive outside when it is less than 35 degrees was a challenge.View attachment 33479

Great write up on your case adventure. Thanks for taking the time to do so. Your project looks great !
As noted the task seems relatively straightforward and simple. In a heartbeat you can be challenged. A pop rivet, material thickness or fabric choice. Glue… stuff happens. University of YT helps but doesn’t have all the answers.
Sharing what we learn from the good or bad is why I come here.

I’m thinking a box made of 1/4” tempered hardboard could work. Properly reinforced and in-use designed, the material is valid and affordable. This compared to setting up an ABS or PVC vacuum mold.
Another 50 hour experiment….

 

[pgboyd]

Key work completed. Stripped off pads, cork, felt. Degreased, washed, cups flattened & round. Every long key needed to be trued.
Key fitting to hinge rods. Then fitted between posts. Yes the body is done too.
View attachment 30672
This was off by 2mm at starting point.View attachment 30673
View attachment 30674

I'm slowly making my way through Pig Squealer's excellent thread. That looks like a great method for truing the long keys. The 1923 Elkhart alto I'm working on was likely an abandoned project of someone's. It arrived stripped of all parts except springs and everything packed in the old moldy case. Most of my long keys were out of true, but I only have my hands and what little patience I can use to try to get them relatively straight. YouTube videos from Matt Stohrer were my primary education. A system like the above pictures would certainly have come in handy. Looks like a metal lathe with a turnout dial to indicate where the bends are. I managed to put everything back together today (actually multiple times since I continued to find keys that were overly tight and wouldn't operate smoothly - yes, I'm looking at you G# mech). My other stencil horn from a similar era was a nice reference point since I've never gotten to this point before in trying to redo a horn from basically no decent pads, springs, and zero felt/cork regulation on the keys.

I was cautiously optimistic after working through padding with the leak light, but today's play test ended in tears and frustration. I tried the original mouthpiece and ligature with a number 2 reed (I know - but I'm still learning and playing 2.5 is still a challenge for me). When that didn't make much sound, I switched to my rental Selmer's mouthpiece and the same reed. The Elkhart sounds pretty stuffy - if I hadn't totally cleaned it out I would have suspected dead rats stuffed in the bell. After working with it for about 15 minutes I was finally able to get some sounds out of the top stack, but it really wants to play an octave high on everything. Obviously I have some key regulation issues or leaks. I held down the keys on the top of the sax and tried playing to see if I could feel anything leaking, but nothing really stands out.

My usual method of working through problems like this is to put it away for a time and come back to it later. If I manage to get everything working correctly I'll post a video and hopefully be able to demo the sound. I wouldn't be surprised if this was the first time this alto has had any air through it for twenty years.

 

[pgboyd]

Great write up on your case adventure. Thanks for taking the time to do so. Your project looks great !
As noted the task seems relatively straightforward and simple. In a heartbeat you can be challenged. A pop rivet, material thickness or fabric choice. Glue… stuff happens. University of YT helps but doesn’t have all the answers.
Sharing what we learn from the good or bad is why I come here.

I’m thinking a box made of 1/4” tempered hardboard could work. Properly reinforced and in-use designed, the material is valid and affordable. This compared to setting up an ABS or PVC vacuum mold.
Another 50 hour experiment….

I plan on trying again with the original case to see if I can get a better fit and finish. I'm going to remove all of the pop rivets and use split-legs. For covering, instead of going with the Tolex I had before I ordered some waterproofed black canvas. I was thinking of black oil paint on canvas, but that seems like extra work that wouldn't necessarily make a better end product. Most of the cases I've seen from that time period seem to be something like black painted canvas or linen, not something like Tolex which was introduced in the early 1950s I believe.

 

[PigSquealer]

I'm slowly making my way through Pig Squealer's excellent thread. That looks like a great method for truing the long keys. The 1923 Elkhart alto I'm working on was likely an abandoned project of someone's. It arrived stripped of all parts except springs and everything packed in the old moldy case. Most of my long keys were out of true, but I only have my hands and what little patience I can use to try to get them relatively straight. YouTube videos from Matt Stohrer were my primary education. A system like the above pictures would certainly have come in handy. Looks like a metal lathe with a turnout dial to indicate where the bends are. I managed to put everything back together today (actually multiple times since I continued to find keys that were overly tight and wouldn't operate smoothly - yes, I'm looking at you G# mech). My other stencil horn from a similar era was a nice reference point since I've never gotten to this point before in trying to redo a horn from basically no decent pads, springs, and zero felt/cork regulation on the keys.

I was cautiously optimistic after working through padding with the leak light, but today's play test ended in tears and frustration. I tried the original mouthpiece and ligature with a number 2 reed (I know - but I'm still learning and playing 2.5 is still a challenge for me). When that didn't make much sound, I switched to my rental Selmer's mouthpiece and the same reed. The Elkhart sounds pretty stuffy - if I hadn't totally cleaned it out I would have suspected dead rats stuffed in the bell. After working with it for about 15 minutes I was finally able to get some sounds out of the top stack, but it really wants to play an octave high on everything. Obviously I have some key regulation issues or leaks. I held down the keys on the top of the sax and tried playing to see if I could feel anything leaking, but nothing really stands out.

My usual method of working through problems like this is to put it away for a time and come back to it later. If I manage to get everything working correctly I'll post a video and hopefully be able to demo the sound. I wouldn't be surprised if this was the first time this alto has had any air through it for twenty years.

Time for you to start a repair question thread😉

Thanks for the compliment. Yes, I sometimes use center points on a lathe to check runout. The actual straightening is done by hand or in a vise. Technique used I’ll post on Pork Tales soon.

I feel for you. Be patient, review each section as a system. A sax is a deceivingly challenging machine.

Install a rubber glove over the bell. Mount the neck. Finger everything closed. Draw a vacuum by sucking from cork end. You should be able to draw the glove down the bell and hold for at least ten seconds. If not, there’s leaks.

The neck / crook is a section system. Place your palm covering the tenon. Blow / hold pressure from on cork end. Operate the octave key. Everything sealing ? Next apply some soapy water to the neck body to tenon joint. Blow again. No bubbles?

You’ll need to make or buy a stopper plug for body receiver. This to check for leakage at body receiver to tenon.

Loose hinge rods in pillars or barrels can give you false sealing readings. Add sprung or unsprung pad setting with loose bits will drive you wacko.
Look at the lower stack, F# & F. The flex load changes when you finger E as RH2(F#) only. F# with backbar still close correctly? Hold E and press G#. F# with backbar still stable & sealing ?

Regardless you’re making good progress. 👍👍

Matt’s videos are great. The drawback is the time it takes to find and view all the content for a task at hand. Looking in his “index” can help expedite finding a need.

Welcome to Stohrer Music.

Hi, my name is Matt Stohrer and I repair saxophones for a living. If you are looking for educational saxophone repair content I have created, please see the Open Source Saxophone Project. 290 articles and videos as of October 2026- and counting. I make my living repairing vintage saxophones full...

www.stohrermusic.com

For a written source. Mr Howard has some fine technical articles specific to subjects. Honestly some of the best troubleshooting information available.
Lot of useful tips (tools) for the DIY repairer / player too.

Stephen Howard Woodwind - Specialist saxophone repairs, tweaks and maintenance.

Stephen Howard Woodwind. The leading resource for sax repair, care and maintenance - and independent reviews from the workbench.

www.shwoodwind.co.uk

Music Medic has a YouTube channel with many good shorts.
Their repair guides can be difficult to understand for the inexperienced DIY technician.

Repair Guides

www.musicmedic.com

 

[pgboyd]

Thanks for the advice. I’ll work through your suggestions and try to move to the right areas of the forum for future questions 🙂