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There's also the fear of admonishment of asking "stupid questions".
I'm self taught, sax. And more recently got an online 'flute' teacher... Chappy is not old but very legit and I get more finger wagging, table slapping etc. from him then I ever have here!
Although the unfortunate truth is there are things only a teacher can see/hear - it's also true that there's lots of folks here who'll help and make other suggestions....
.... Let rip!

But the question for this thread is how should people be made to feel it's ok to ask "stupid questions"? To generate more engagement for the site as well as help folks.
 
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all the same i value the site and it would be a shame if it to disappear. i did, a while ago ask people here about hln oof bassic sax. i got replies only about the site, such as they were. what about the person?

i think we could look after each other a little better.
 
Adults like us, still like games...and prizes !!
If participation is an issue, gamification is a way forward:
I bet participation would increase if there was some sort of easy weekly game or competition to win some sax related material ( mouthpiece, ligatures, reeds and so on)
 
I'll started a new thread about one common query re: search and old posts vs new post

The 2nd thing for me is that when certain characters detract from the topic with a smart remark that gets jumped on for fun and we go way off, I just stop bothering with the thread. I don't think the intention is usually to destroy interest or deliberate but it has that effect for me personally.

Yes I agree this is often unhelpful (and can be very bad for SEO) in information threads and we will often move that to an off topic section. OTOH some people have said one thing they like about the cafe is the off topic fun.

I don't understand what it costs to run a forum/website and because I actually try to avoid spending too much time online (which is difficult) I don't subscribe to many things.

I will make a separate thread about the costs and our finances of the cafe

My limited knowledge is that Google doesn't like duplicate content - stemming from the days you'd have one page 'saxophone shop manchester' and the same page targeting 'saxophone shop Liverpool'.

Google is a law unto itself. Duplicate content may not be "penalised" as such, just that it is naturally lower down in the search results because two duplicate pages are competing with each other.

Google also likes to see new content, the more active a site, the more relevant it thinks it is.

Well, again I'm not sure. But the more active a site is the more frequently the Google bot might "crawl" it looking for stuff to index. But still, it's the quality of the content that counts most and forums suffer from threads often containing less relevant stuff because they aren't crafted by a professional article writer and there's loads of different people involved. (UGC)

Could you email a questionnaire to members - those who haven't logged in for a while could give some insight into why not.

A huge task, it's a list of 1000s. Many are dead email links and our email provider (Postmark) may well drop us due to it looking like spam.

Café capitalises on promotion of all facets of the saxophone and music arts. Also, due to excellent moderation, it lacks trolling and abusive posts, which I found to exist on at least on one other popular non-social media sax forum.

Thanks yes we always like to moderate fairly and diplomatically. Spam is very very rare due to our anti spam measures.

Make connections with appropriate people/businesses,
Tricky one. many businesses know about us but most actually make a point of steering clear of forums and suchlike.
Do we not need more subscribers, "Cafe supporters"?
Always nice to have but not a deal breaker.
A solution to this could be a new rule that allows non-English posts as long as an English translation is provided in the same message.
Done!
Do a monthly or weekly listing of gigs/workshops that are happening in the UK/EU that 1: members are playing or attending 2: that non members can promote.
Great but I know I couldn't take on such a mammoth task.

These next two are related and appear a bit contradictory.
Here, a struggling or inquisitive beginner or intermediate, or even one at an advanced level can freely post without derogatory negative criticism, with many who with good intent want to help that person.
That's what we like and encourage.

There's also the fear of admonishment of asking "stupid questions"... especially when coming as a self-taught beginner, I get the feeling that the answers I'll get is, "I should find a teacher to see what I'm doing wrong in-person".
That can happen but in the (maybe more rare) circumstance of when something really can't be answered online. Anyone with those understandable fears would be encouraged to post a video so we get a better chance.

One fear I have is giving an answer that contradicts someone's teacher - there are different ways of doing things which can lead to confusion.

worse still, stupid answers! i remember being told off up here in the past and even accused of tax fraud. live and let live., please.
That should not have happened, if it does please report but you have the right attitude of live and let live.
I bet participation would increase if there was some sort of easy weekly game or competition to win some sax related material ( mouthpiece, ligatures, reeds and so on)
Yes we could look into that, but quite big thing to organise. And workinging out a diplomatic and democratic way to judge could be the hardest thing.
 
I want to jump on the gig-list bandwagon - but with the caveat that it should be run by the members rather than the moderators. There is a forum here for listing one’s gigs and releases, but it is not used much. Maybe there is a way to up the visibility of that, so that more people use it. I see all sorts of posts about concerts and rehearsals, but they aren’t in that forum. I think people feel that a community band, or a local sax quartet, or a church concert isn’t really a “gig” because it’s not professionals getting paid. But it’s important to have notice of these things, and they are just as interesting to me, even though I am 10,000 miles away from the UK.

If the Cafe could become known as an important reaource for posting and reading info about saxophone related performance, it might drive up participation. (Of course, reading that last sentence, I become conscious of the fact that playing saxophone means I am a dinosaur…)
 
Another thought... I wonder if the Reactions feature can be detrimental for user engagement?

It feels all too tempting to just click React and add a "like" on a post, rather than to actually post something, even if it's just a simple "nice, I liked it". I'm seeing this especially in user-posted music, but I think it can apply to just about any other thread.

But on the other hand, I do understand the reluctance to post especially about other user's sound clips... it's kind of the same issue experienced in photography forums. Some users just don't know how to comment and critique other's works properly, some may fear offending the OP, and others (like me) may feel like they're too newbie/beginner to comment on other's works.

Of course, this is assuming that Reactions alone don't really contribute to user engagement, and you actually have to post something for it to count. Disregard if that's already the case.
 
Another thought... I wonder if the Reactions feature can be detrimental for user engagement?

It feels all too tempting to just click React and add a "like" on a post, rather than to actually post something, even if it's just a simple "nice, I liked it". I'm seeing this especially in user-posted music, but I think it can apply to just about any other thread.

But on the other hand, I do understand the reluctance to post especially about other user's sound clips... it's kind of the same issue experienced in photography forums. Some users just don't know how to comment and critique other's works properly, some may fear offending the OP, and others (like me) may feel like they're too newbie/beginner to comment on other's works.

Of course, this is assuming that Reactions alone don't really contribute to user engagement, and you actually have to post something for it to count. Disregard if that's already the case.
We have all sorts of personalities in this forum, and everyone has their own opinions, likes and dislikes including motives. Just like anything, it can be a tool misused. However with Café's diligent management team keep abuses in check, I have not seen anyone truly go overboard. I used to post in another very popular non-social media sax forum, but it was filled with some vicious commenters. I even witnessed a "newbie" receive abusive replies for simply asking rudimentary questions.

Personally I like it, because I consider it a way to affirm a person's thoughts similar to a "like" in social media, when I agree but do not feel a need to provide a verbal reply.

With a plethora of choices in "Smilies", one can select one more precise to their feelings. Some may seem "silly", but the environment here is more like a family with a sense of camaraderie. So, humour is permitted, too, within reason. And, one can also express disapproval especially if the comment is inappropriate.

One person made a succinct personal observation (not here), "We are born with hard hearts and thin skins. We spend the rest of our lives developing a soft heart and thick skins."

Personally overall I have not seen any pose harsh critical reviews of one's playing performance. It may have happened in the past, but personally I have not seen it. Most IMO have been truly helpful.

When I have received what may be a "critical rebuttal", am I over-reacting? Or, is there some merit to a less than complimentary reply? Sometimes, it is best to step away, and look at it the next day when fully rested.
 
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How to get members?
It's not easy to expand CS "in a declining market". Maybe less is more after all?

How to get existing members to engage more?
"Autodidact/self learning, Rock & Roll Saxophone, new teaching methods ....." turns me on. But I like to read about all kind of saxophone related topics ....... .
 
It feels all too tempting to just click React and add a "like" on a post, rather than to actually post something, even if it's just a simple "nice, I liked it"
That is the whole point of reactions, so there aren’t so many posts that don’t help with SEO. Threads are less cluttered but people still show appreciation, thanks, agreement.
 
Another suggestion... over at another forum, I notice one prolific user often organizes weekly online (Zoom?) meetings, to discuss various sax and music-related topics. I wonder why we don't have such a thing over here?
Do you mean SOTW? We have had zoom meetings here, anyone is free to organise them. But perhaps they actually take engagement away from the forum although maybe it’s the opposite.
And, one can also express disapproval especially
Well, we phrase that reaction as respectfully disagree as opposed to ******
 
It seems like there are two related but different questions being asked here - 1) How do you keep the Cafe as the lively, engaging and informative online space it is, preferably by keeping new members joining and getting involved and 2) how do you ensure it remains financially viable. For the second question, I'd say quite a lot of people, myself included, would be happy to support, but need prompting - I just upgraded based on your posts this week - most valuable, independent online resources have a 'buy me a coffee' button or similar. Likewise, with bloggers on Substack etc., I subscribe when I really like the content (Ethan Iverson's Transitional Technology, for example) and am reminded. Otherwise, like most other people, I just take it all for free without a second's thought, unfortunately.

So, I'd say on the financial side, you could be a little more obvious and maybe less British... it's great that members can join with no obligation, but if the prompts are there, I think quite a few people would chip in. Incidentally, the numerous subscription options are confusing - I couldn't clearly see what the difference was except for monthly/annual and different colours... simpler would be better, I think, plus maybe a one-off 'buy me a new reed' button...

For how to keep it lively and engaging, as well as informative... well, it is. I hardly ever interact, but still enjoy and appreciate it, and have got really useful info when I asked. If there's any criticism I'd echo, it would be that the conversations do feel pretty 'male' and possibly middle-aged... but then as a 50-something man, maybe I'm just tuning into my own frequency...
 
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So, I'd say on the financial side, you could be a little more obvious and maybe less British... it's great that members can join with no obligation, but if the prompts are there, I think quite a few people would chip in. Incidentally, the numerous subscription options are confusing - I couldn't clearly see what the difference was except for monthly/annual and different colours... simpler would be better, I think, plus maybe a one-off 'buy me a new reed' button...
It is in quite your face when people register, and it's also obvious that the upgrades are basically the same apart from the annual ones giving immediate access to Classifieds.

Screenshot 2024-11-15 at 10.20.34.webp



I need to make it more obvious in the user account area for people upgrading later.
 

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