Body Bends

[ribiq]

If all keys, adj. materials, etc. are removed (from a silver plated brass instrument), and a body bend was not successfully fixed using the body slam tool or something similar, and there is some work hardening as a result, what is typically done? Is a mandrel always used, or is there a process of annealing, straightening, and then hardening again that works just as well? Assuming the former is preferred, just curious

 

[jbtsax]

I repair saxophones for a living, but annealing and work hardening brass is not my area of expertise. Here are a few thoughts upon reading your post.

1. I was taught to do the "body slam" to straighten a typical "banana bend" in a saxophone with the keys on the instrument.
2. I have never repaired a bent saxophone where this technique didn't work.
3. Typically a tapered mandrel is used inside the body with the bell removed when a significant number of dents need to be removed by tapping or rolling.
4. The temperature required to "anneal" an area of brass would be high enough to cause soft soldered parts come off.

@Stephen Howard may be able to share more information on this topic.

 

[ribiq]

I repair saxophones for a living, but annealing and work hardening brass is not my area of expertise. Here are a few thoughts upon reading your post.

1. I was taught to do the "body slam" to straighten a typical "banana bend" in a saxophone with the keys on the instrument.
2. I have never repaired a bent saxophone where this technique didn't work.
3. Typically a tapered mandrel is used inside the body with the bell removed when a significant number of dents need to be removed by tapping or rolling.
4. The temperature required to "anneal" an area of brass would be high enough to cause soft soldered parts come off.

@Stephen Howard may be able to share more information on this topic.

Thanks for the reply. That's what I figured; I wondered if there was any kind of "gentler" annealing process for this that was known, but from what I understand it's more a matter of reaching a specific temperature threshold for the annealing to take effect.

I've seen good examples of using tapered partial mandrels on a long dent rod with the bow removed, but just wondered if it could be done without having to remove the brace, guards, etc.

This horn has been through it and who knows more might have been done to it in the past beyond what is visible... Thanks again!

 

[JayeNM]

Can you post a photo of what the current condition is , ribiq?

I am also having trouble understanding why the 'slam' technique (LOL, have we just coined a new tech phrase here ?) didn't work .

I do it a fair amount, with bell attached, and as long as you locate the point where the bend is and set up accordingly, I too have found it works a vast majority of the time....except if it is a bend not like the "Banana bend" (LOL again, I like it) but rather, say, a bend due to an impact injury which may have, for example crumpled or ovalized a tonehole as a result, the tube being straight and plumb up until that particular tonehole, in which case going with the slam technique with apparatus inserted at top of neck receiver and receiving the slam impact - isn't the best way to address those kinda bends, IMHO.

 

[ribiq]

Thanks for your input, I actually think I have it where I want it now. Should be all set. Surprised it was so uncooperative but all's well

 

[griff136]

I repair saxophones for a living, but annealing and work hardening brass is not my area of expertise. Here are a few thoughts upon reading your post.

1. I was taught to do the "body slam" to straighten a typical "banana bend" in a saxophone with the keys on the instrument.
2. I have never repaired a bent saxophone where this technique didn't work.
3. Typically a tapered mandrel is used inside the body with the bell removed when a significant number of dents need to be removed by tapping or rolling.
4. The temperature required to "anneal" an area of brass would be high enough to cause soft soldered parts come off.

@Stephen Howard may be able to share more information on this topic.

+1 on what JBTsax said. I "slam" with the keys on, use the Boehm overlapping tapered body mandrel set for dents on the tube.