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Saxophone beginners Any tips for transcribing?

Do any of you experienced transcribers have any tips? I’m attempting to transcribe this beautiful tune: 'Way Back Home'
Chris

Hi Chris,

This is a very late response ( quite a few years ) but I believe forum threads form a knowledge base that is often useful to others at a later date.

I agree with others here that slowing down with software is a big help, in particular targeting short problematic sections and looping them at different speeds - I use Sound Forge Audio Studio which came for free with Sony Vegas Movie Studio.

I think the greatest benefit to your transcribing ability is your own tone development and that is why someone like Wilton is going to be tough because he is out there on his own platform.

I suppose I do spend time transcribing but without paper and pen, I don't write it down because I want to approach it fresh every time so for me transcribing is playing along to the track but really transcribing is
the secondary process - whats really on my mind is tone - sometimes I try and play what the player is playing other times I find complimentary lines but really tone is the start the finish and the middle of the exercise. I feel that tone leads everything else in playing - all other aspects of playing get easier when tone gets fuller has more focus and projects - good timing wont improve your tone but good tone will improve your timing - it will simply be easier and more obvious whats wrong and correction may even be subconscious when it can really and easily be heard, in addition attack and air control are more likely to be optimal when tone is good.

If this sounds back to front then I guess I am saying that by the time someone manages to get a tone not necessarily "like" but comparable in their own way with Wilton Felder then they will also be playing the same notes as him and it will be easier to hear when they hit the same note when the tones are in the same league - ( ok I know few people will sound as good as Wilton but if I say that every time it will be repetitive ). I am not saying that improving tone is a long winded exercise so there is time for everything else to improve I am saying that improvements in tone bring about improvements in all other aspects of playing.

The difficultly I feel in transcription is that when there is a big gap between a player's own tone and the other player then it will be harder to compare notes with his - this does not mean tone mimicry or "clone players", a players tone might different to Wilton's but when it has similar depth, focus and harmonic richness then it will be so much easier to hear the interval between the guess note and the target note - it will simply be easier to hear when its wrong and then its just a matter of moving up or down.

Magically give a player the same kind of tone as Wilton Felder and I suggest overnight he/she would improve dramatically in transcribing Wilton Felder without any special effort or training.

Someone like Wilton is not playing single tones - each of his "notes" is a big harmonic package with all kinds of wonderful overtones, bends and nuances in there - it sounds great but makes it more difficult to compare against a thinner tone.

I would say slow the track down and go through the motions of transcribing but really be thinking more about tone - the tone will lead the transcribing ability not the other way around. If the track is played slowly enough then really the issue is only that you are a tone or a semitone out from the thing you are hearing - what can be easier than moving up or down until you find the target note? The fly in the ointment, the thing that stops it all being that simple is when you are comparing radically different quality of sound and harmonic.

Easier to transcribe classical guitar from classical guitar, more difficult to transcribe electric guitar from church organ even if they played single notes and not chords - different harmonic overtones - much more confusing.
 
Chris hasn't bee around for a while (sadly) but if you want to draw his attention to a post, you can tag him using the @ sign like this:

@Chris98

...And into my email program popped a message saying I'd been tagged, assuming my past sins had caught up with me, and there was now a price on my head, I quickly ducked under the desk. Peering up at the screen once more I noticed who it was from, and relief flooded over me🙂

Thanks for your reply Jonnie, it's never too late for good advice. I have to confess that I've not played my saxophones in an embarrassingly long time, that was until tonight, getting Pete's 'tag' and reading your post prompted me to pull the sax out of the case, and for the last fifty or so minutes I've been going though a lot of old (and easy) material. I've missed it without realising it, so thank you both.
 
Transposing is something that I need to work on. I can get the notes more or less ok but the timings elude me. Not good.

Hi Little,

I have only just started using the multi-tracking facility of the free software Audacity after reading Colin's comment on another thread so its way too early to be a software evangelist 😱 but I think it might be fun or instructive to use a laptop and a pair of headphones. Record the problematic piece onto track 1 and then record yourself on other tracks, muting or throwing away as you see fit when you want to do the next take.

I used it in a similar way not for transcribing but for building up a tune bit by bit - I ended up with ten versions of the same lick, being able to play back at leisure selecting each one in turn against the backing track being able to consider its merits or bad points whilst sucking on your coffee might be a nice way to pass the afternoon?

Of course it can be done without the software, just loop the backing track and keep on banging away until the lick is right but I am fascinated with the option to be able to retrospectively listen to each attempt and at the drop of a hat being able to do lick version 4 take 3 because lick version 4 take 2 was a good idea but badly played or weigh it up against the alternative lick version 3 take 2 which leads off in a totally different direction.

I also found it interesting to try playing the same lick twice, and playing back both takes, neither muted so that I can hear how well or badly I am managing to play accurately against myself - in timing there is being randomly wrong and being consistently wrong? A useful feature is the little "x" delete in the top of each track's frame - useful for those little ditties you didnt want to keep lying around.

I have no idea whether all this messing around will improve my playing / timing / improvisational skill its too early for me to have any idea on that as I have only been at it (audacity) for a few days since Colin's post but I do think it opens up possibilities and is worth a try, at the very least I am finding it great fun.
 
I have no idea whether all this messing around will improve my playing / timing / improvisational skill its too early for me to have any idea on that as I have only been at it (audacity) for a few days since Colin's post but I do think it opens up possibilities and is worth a try, at the very least I am finding it great fun.

I am pretty sure it will improve your playing. Listening back and learning from it can only have a positive impact on your future playing 🙂

Jx
 
Biggest mistake i find when myself or others are transcribing is that if you are having difficulty with a phrase but you can sense one of the notes isnt quite right, is to sing the first few notes of the phrase and then play them, even if you only start with the first note by itself, then only play back the phrase on the recording up to the next note so your ear hears only the next note in the phrase when you stop the recording, this is so you can lock on to the pitch, if you go past that note you can lose the pitch , keep adding a note at a time, every time humming/singing that last note so you have it firmly in your ear.
When i was younger i was really fast at transcribing bass lines but now im over 50 im always questioning myself and having to slow down!
 
No doubt transcription have a lot of virtues and it'd politically incorrect to say the opposite. But one sometimes needs to pick up a tune or a solo for playing it in a band or to arrange it, without spending days to use the excellent methods mentioned above. A few years ago, I tried one or two softwares which were supposed to automatically transcribe mp3 files ; one was even, theoretically, able to transcribe multi-instrument arranged pieces. I must admit that none of these contraptions - of which I forgot the names - worked decently, for me anyway. But, in a few years great progresses might have occurred. Has anybody heard of or tried or uses such software ?
 
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No doubt transcription have a lot of virtues and it'd politically incorrect to say the opposite.
I don't know about "politically incorrect", but I reckon you'd be daft to call it a waste of time.
Has anybody heard of or tried or uses such software ?
No, it still doesn't exist. The quickest way is still to trawl round the internet to see if somebody has already done it (often found hidden in midi files) then to knuckle down and do the usual way.
 
I found this interesting YouTube clip of a transcription of "Way Back Home"

It looks to me like Band in a Box being used in a creative way to help or even do the transcription, by defining bars and beats and by highlighting the notes played by the tenor sax.

This should be of interest to @Chris98

Rhys
Can you do that in Band in a Box? I thought only Transcribe did that.
 
Can you do that in Band in a Box? I thought only Transcribe did that.

In my version of Band in a Box I have found out how to get the software to display the "piano roll" with all the notes it detects, to work out the tempo, bar lines, beats and guess at the chords. That looks very like the bottom half of the screen in the YouTube video I posted.

I haven't worked out whether you can highlight certain notes on the piano roll and get the software to transcribe those, as seems to have been done in the top half of the video.

Looking more closely at the screen display, it is Apple software and is quite a bit different to BiaB in the details. I wonder whether this is some new software to help with transcribing ?

Rhys

PS I think the video has twice as many bars as I hear (maybe better for notating detail) and is possibly in the wrong key.
 
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Great Find Rhys.

I don't have band in a box, so can't compare, but up at the top left were the program title usually is, it says: muDic. So, is this band in a box or something similar. Maybe muDic is a translation?

Thanks again.
Chris
 

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