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Saxophones: gear, playing, repair, impro
Resolving chords
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<blockquote data-quote="turf3" data-source="post: 628482" data-attributes="member: 8105"><p>I will respectfully suggest that all the recommendations about complex chord substitutions etc. really don't apply to the song in question, certainly not for a beginning improviser.</p><p></p><p>Again - what we have here is a tune built on two-bar cells of descending chords, more or less over and over. In the A parts, there are some turnarounds where there are actual chord resolutions, in the bridge it's just the descending two bar cells over and over for the eight bars of the bridge.</p><p></p><p>In the recording I posted - which appears to be the reference recording, and the one the OP's familiar with - what I hear in everyone's playing EXCEPT Rollins', is a whole lot of Bb minor and the occasional F7 thrown in to turn us back to Bb minor. (My ears may be in error; I'm not next to a keyboard; but that's what I hear.) The descending chords in the rhythm section provide "chordal drive and movement" (not sure of the correct technical terms) and the soloists are then free to more or less stay in Bb minor.</p><p></p><p>If I were tossed this tune to solo on, that's probably what I'd do the first many times through. Later, I MIGHT get into more explicitly stating some of the descending chords, or throwing in other interesting sounds (and I'd be doing it based on sound not theoretical analysis, but that's a different discussion), but certainly for the beginning improviser, I think the approach taken here by most all the soloists on that recording is a good one - mostly Bb minor with some F7 sounds thrown in. </p><p></p><p>OP, I think it's important to keep in mind that there are MANY approaches to constructing an improvisation over chords. If you've got real well defined circle-of-fifth type chord changes, the third-and-seventh-guide-tones concept is useful. If you're looking at a bunch of ii-V7-I patterns, then the concept of using the same set of pitches over all three chords in that cell is useful (I forgot the techincal term for this). If you're looking at repeated descending patterns, the idea of just hanging on one tonality and letting the chords do what they will is interesting. If you're looking at a straight no-frills 12 bar basic blues, the blues scale across all three chords is useful. (But on the other hand, if you're looking at a complex "Bird Blues" where the piano player is piling substitution upon substitution till no man may know the basic chord; just slathering the blues scale over the whole thing risks sounding coarse and dull.) "Rhythm changes"? Well, there are dozens of ways to approach this and a gifted soloist with a big vocabulary will do it differently every time through.</p><p></p><p>So, it's horses for courses. I don't think focusing on 3 and 7 guide tones and V7-I resolutions are the tools to start with in trying to make an interesting and compelling improvisation over the particular tune in question.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="turf3, post: 628482, member: 8105"] I will respectfully suggest that all the recommendations about complex chord substitutions etc. really don't apply to the song in question, certainly not for a beginning improviser. Again - what we have here is a tune built on two-bar cells of descending chords, more or less over and over. In the A parts, there are some turnarounds where there are actual chord resolutions, in the bridge it's just the descending two bar cells over and over for the eight bars of the bridge. In the recording I posted - which appears to be the reference recording, and the one the OP's familiar with - what I hear in everyone's playing EXCEPT Rollins', is a whole lot of Bb minor and the occasional F7 thrown in to turn us back to Bb minor. (My ears may be in error; I'm not next to a keyboard; but that's what I hear.) The descending chords in the rhythm section provide "chordal drive and movement" (not sure of the correct technical terms) and the soloists are then free to more or less stay in Bb minor. If I were tossed this tune to solo on, that's probably what I'd do the first many times through. Later, I MIGHT get into more explicitly stating some of the descending chords, or throwing in other interesting sounds (and I'd be doing it based on sound not theoretical analysis, but that's a different discussion), but certainly for the beginning improviser, I think the approach taken here by most all the soloists on that recording is a good one - mostly Bb minor with some F7 sounds thrown in. OP, I think it's important to keep in mind that there are MANY approaches to constructing an improvisation over chords. If you've got real well defined circle-of-fifth type chord changes, the third-and-seventh-guide-tones concept is useful. If you're looking at a bunch of ii-V7-I patterns, then the concept of using the same set of pitches over all three chords in that cell is useful (I forgot the techincal term for this). If you're looking at repeated descending patterns, the idea of just hanging on one tonality and letting the chords do what they will is interesting. If you're looking at a straight no-frills 12 bar basic blues, the blues scale across all three chords is useful. (But on the other hand, if you're looking at a complex "Bird Blues" where the piano player is piling substitution upon substitution till no man may know the basic chord; just slathering the blues scale over the whole thing risks sounding coarse and dull.) "Rhythm changes"? Well, there are dozens of ways to approach this and a gifted soloist with a big vocabulary will do it differently every time through. So, it's horses for courses. I don't think focusing on 3 and 7 guide tones and V7-I resolutions are the tools to start with in trying to make an interesting and compelling improvisation over the particular tune in question. [/QUOTE]
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