Don't Tongue Notation

[Veggie Dave]

Is there any notation that indicates that a note shouldn't be tongued or should only be tongued as lightly as possible?

 

[Tenor Viol]

Either an instruction to play legato or a slur over the affected notes. To play 'lightly' with little articulation would leggiero

 

[Pete Effamy]

Not really. We have no markings at all, then we add staccato and accents etc to go less than full marked value or accented.
Nothing to go lighter. Down to the player to feel the nature of the music.

 

[jbtsax]

Is there any notation that indicates that a note shouldn't be tongued or should only be tongued as lightly as possible?

Yes. They're called "slurs".

 

[JayeNM]

Not really.

Actually there is.....this is the standard musical notation used in our part of the world....

 

[JayeNM]

...seen with a 'cross out' when the composer wants NO tonguing....

...seen GREYED OUT when composer calls for light tonguing....

 

[Tenor Viol]

Not really. We have no markings at all, then we add staccato and accents etc to go less than full marked value or accented.
Nothing to go lighter. Down to the player to feel the nature of the music.

I don't agree - that's what slurs are for and also the articulation instructions 'legato' and 'leggiero'

 

[Pete Effamy]

Yes you are correct re classical. I presumed that Dave was talking about section playing which uses jazz language. Unless a section is completely slurred, or staccato all notes will often be left unmarked. It's up to the player to know how heavy/light to articulate.

 

[Pete Effamy]

Yes. They're called "slurs".

He said (?) specifically "note". Not notes.

 

[Pete Thomas]

Some confusion here

Is there any notation that indicates that a note shouldn't be tongued or should only be tongued as lightly as possible?

I preseume you are talking about starting notws with no tongue articulation, but not slurring from a previous note. ie starting from nothing?

Either an instruction to play legato or a slur over the affected notes.

So not slurring

To play 'lightly' with little articulation would leggiero

I didn't know that.

Yes. They're called "slurs".

See above, I don't think dave is talking about slurs.

...seen with a 'cross out' when the composer wants NO tonguing....

...seen GREYED OUT when composer calls for light tonguing....

Never seen that.

Staring a (non-legato) note without tonguing is common as a sort of effct when soloing. Can sound a bit like "F" as the air eases into the mouthpiece. And of course the saxohpnoe laugh is done by "K" articulation as opposed to T or D.

My understanding though is that all tonguing should be light tip of the tongue, unless marked otherwise.

 

[Pete Effamy]

I repeat Dave's question:

Is there any notation that indicates that a note shouldn't be tongued or should only be tongued as lightly as possible?

My understanding though is that all tonguing should be light tip of the tongue, unless marked otherwise.

Correct.

 

[jbtsax]

He said (?) specifically "note". Not notes.

"A note" under a slur is not tongued. Plus my response was meant to be "tongue in cheek" regardless.

 

[Pete Effamy]

Typical horn chart...

 

[Pete Effamy]

"A note" under a slur is not tongued. Plus my response was meant to be "tongue in cheek" regardless.

Ah, you should have laughed louder.

 

[Pete Thomas]

There is also a notation of legato tonguing, which is a series of notes with tenuto marks and a slur, see B

 

[Veggie Dave]

I preseume you are talking about starting notws with no tongue articulation, but not slurring from a previous note. ie starting from nothing?

Yes, exactly this.

There is also a notation of legato tonguing, which is a series of notes with tenuto marks and a slur, see B

The page can't be found.

 

[Pete Effamy]

leggiero

Not likely to be used in non-classical formats. <as a direction>

 

[jbtsax]

I was taught that depending upon the style of the piece, the tempo, and dynamic level some phrases (usually slurred) are best started with a "breath entrance". Some call it a "breath attack" which I have never cared for since we don't "attack" notes, we play them. This type of entrance is sometimes used to imitate a bowed string instrument or the voice.

In my experience "articulation markings" are often interpreted differently in a jazz chart than in a classical piece---mostly in terms of intensity or exaggeration. This can also depend upon the tempo and style of the jazz arrangement.

 

[Pete Effamy]

In my experience "articulation markings" are often interpreted differently in a jazz chart than in a classical piece---mostly in terms of intensity or exaggeration. This can also depend upon the tempo and style of the jazz arrangement.

Totally agree. Though with no song or other information available other than a written note on its own, both classical and all other music presume a light tongue start/attack.

 

[Pete Effamy]

I was taught that depending upon the style of the piece, the tempo, and dynamic level some phrases (usually slurred) are best started with a "breath entrance".

I was never taught this - but I'm not saying that you're wrong here.