Playing live, ie in front of an audience

[Pete Thomas]

"Playing to an audience gives you the opportunity to get over nerves or self doubt. Just go for it because I bet 99% of anyone who has never played in front of someone else will get a great buzz and feeling of achievement from doing something as simple as that."


These posts have been moved from the dream horn thread, to provide a brand new thread about playing live

For rock: Martin Comm3, For jazz: Conn 10m, For practice Selmer SA 80 II For Live: Yani TW 010

LOL. I guess I should’ve said ‘anything with an audience’.

The question still applies, why a different rock horn whether or not there is an audience?

 

[MarkSax]

The question still applies, why a different rock horn whether or not there is an audience?

Because the Martin Comm3 I have, paired with a Meyer 7 ebonite mpc, I can make roar and scream and all sorts of noises that I can’t do with another mpc or sax. Problem is I can’t replicate that in front of an audience. I have no idea why. Maybe because my hands are better suited for the ergonomics of the Yani for rapid playing. Or something else. The Yani is so easy to play, less air and so instinctive, plus it’s got loads of tone that I can play with. But “raw “ and ‘roar’ it does not sound. Maybe it’s just me.

 

[Pete Thomas]

Problem is I can’t replicate that in front of an audience. I have no idea why.

OK, I see. That is quite a weird and serious problem IMO.

 

[thomsax]

Problem is I can’t replicate that in front of an audience.

Why are you playing in front of an audience? If you are professional and the audience is paying your bills I can understand. But otherwise ..... avoid audience. I use to pick my "loudest" Martin tenor, my biggest high baffled Rovner mpc (#10) with a #4 baritone plasticover reed. The few in the audience loved it. At last, a sax player that is trying to play Rock & Roll Saxophone.

 

[mrblackbat]

Why are you playing in front of an audience? If you are professional and the audience is paying your bills I can understand. But otherwise ..... avoid audience. I use to pick my "loudest" Martin tenor, my biggest high baffled Rovner mpc (#10) with a #4 baritone plasticover reed. The few in the audience loved it. At last, a sax player that is trying to play Rock & Roll Saxophone.

But playing in front of an audience brings a whole different aspect to music, regardless of whether they are paying your bills or not.

I play differently when with an audience, feed off their response tonwhat is being played and start to play to and for them. When playing on my own, or with just fellow musicians playing together I play in a different way completely because of the situation - I'm playing for me or the band there, but that provides a different sense of pleasure and enjoyment for me.

Hal Galper has a great video talking about this, and how you have to practise performing and the only way to practise performing is by performing.

 

[thomsax]

I know many professional musicians and they probably just been playing 20-30% in front of an audience. Playing on their own practicing (learning new songs or refreshing old songs), studio/session work, band rehearsals ..... .

I'm (a woodshed honker that's been playing most of my time on my own) trying to play/practice as if I was playing in front of an audience. And I've just been playing in front of audience maybe 10 times over the years (I started to play 1968 ). Ok, persons that use to go to jams are also an audience.

This summer I've been to some concerts. Some artists and musicians are not ready to face a paying audience. They are playing and acting as they we're playing in a basement. Soundcheck in front of the audience, bad vocal articulation (if you are going to sing originals the lyrics is important) ....... .

To play at home with foam on the walls and good recording stuff is one thing. To play live in front of an audience is another thing.

Back to our dream horns.

 

[Pete Thomas]

But otherwise ..... avoid audience.

But a big (maybe biggest) part of playing music is to be able to play for others, give pleasure, joy or any other emotional reaction to music.

 

[mrblackbat]

To play at home with foam on the walls and good recording stuff is one thing. To play live in front of an audience is another thing.

Yes, which is why you need to practise doing the latter in order to get better at it. And it's very much worth it, as Pete mentions above.

 

[jazzdoh]

Why are you playing in front of an audience? If you are professional and the audience is paying your bills I can understand. But otherwise ..... avoid audience.

You don't have to be a professional player to play successfully in front of a audience, I would say 90% of musicians who play to an audience are not earning their living from playing, for me it's what keeps me motivated.

 

[thomsax]

But a big (maybe biggest) part of playing music is to be able to play for others, give pleasure, joy or any other emotional reaction to music.

Yes. If a person can't play, for various reasons, in front of an audience you can practice more or get some help. But the sax player should always a have a good feeling. Otherwise it's better to find other ways to play the saxophone. I don't like to play on front of an audience. For me the saxophone was something It was never my job or my goal wasn't to play professionally. It was something I did for fun. I don't like when I'm in focus. But I learned to wear a hat/cap and sunglasses and to really stay focused. No eye contact.

 

[Dr G]

But a big (maybe biggest) part of playing music is to be able to play for others, give pleasure, joy or any other emotional reaction to music.

I understand that playing for an audience is not a goal for everyone. That aside, I recognize that I am grieving for losing the opportunity to play with my bandmates of the last 20+ years since moving away. That shared experience of band and audience may not have been my everything, but it was certainly a lot.

 

[Saxlicker]

I turned my back on band reunion for various reasons a couple of years ago. During the first period there were many great times which is how I like to remember it. It wasn't all plain sailing though and the older I get the less capacity I have for repeat dealings of the stuff that didn't go so well.
Yet fresh opportunities that suit me don't come so thick and fast now. Again there are many reasons for that and the main one is I'm a whole lot more decided on what I would like to do as opposed to whats out there.
Combine this with the levels and expectations and things can get quite limited.
But after a long hiatus I'm getting finally getting hungry again.

 

[Pete Thomas]

I understand that playing for an audience is not a goal for everyone. T

I agree, I was just responding to @thomsax saying "avoid audience"

I totally respect anyone taking up an instrument as a hobby but when you do so if you get the opportunity to play to an audience then I'd encourage that. And by audience I mean it could be your in-laws or grandparents come to visit. Or a few friends at a party saying "c'mon play us a tune"

It's the opportunity to get over nerves or self doubt. Just go for it because I bet 99% of anyone who has never played in front of someone else will get a great buzz and feeling of achievement from doing something as simple as that.

I have occasionally been asked to give lessons to beginners and if so I make sure the first thing I do is get them to be able to play Happy Birthday without sheet music. That's all it may need to give wonder, happiness and enjoyment due to the power of music.

 

[Pete Thomas]

I have now moved these posts from the dream horn poll.

 

[thomsax]

by audience

... means to me spectators/listeners at a public event, often announced. With or without payment, hobby or professional players ....

 

[MarkSax]

I played by myself for 5 years and more, just in front of the computer screen with my digital partitions and backing tracks. I was very happy doing that until I got to a point where I felt I was good enough to play for others. Joined a band, some group busking, music day in France….. I am not going to recount my shortcomings, some more embarrassing than others but the feeling of playing for an audience, sharing that moment in music, is a major adrenaline high.
At the same time I try not to disappoint so put extra pressure on myself. Vintage horns are not as easy as modern horns in my experience. Although they, again imo, sound nicer they require more work, whether it’s fingering notes or embouchure, minor modifications and rectification here and there to stay more or less in tune, good tone, subtone….altissimo. I can’t do all that and make the sax growl and scream like I do when noone is watching. Which is why I prefer the Yani when Live. It plays in tune with one embouchure and the ergos are great for me. I never ‘fail’ on the Yani. I do on everything else when I feel some expectation of performance. Stagefright? I think it’s more than that.

 

[lydian]

In addition to the buzz and feeling of achievement, having a gig as a goal motivates you to perfect your repertoire in a limited amount of time, making you a better musician in the end. Most of my practice and group rehearsals have gigs as the ultimate goal.

Granted some gigs are a hassle. Maybe the time is inconvenient or the venue is difficult to get to or the audience isn't paying attention or responding. But when I have a good audience that's engaged, dancing and responding to the music, I feel the energy which I put right back into my playing. It's a fantastic feeling, and it's addictive. I'm only an amateur, but I still get a lot of fulfillment from gigs and from all the practice I do to prepare for them.

I got terrible stage fright when I was young. Playing in the big band and having to stand up in front of everybody and improvise a solo makes you feel like every note is being scrutinized and judged. It made it hard to focus and do a good job. But that got better over time and eventually went away. There isn't anything I can play at home that I can't play in front of an audience. But nerves and distractions still cause me to make a few mistakes on gigs. I never have a perfect gig.

 

[thomsax]

I have played in front of a group persons many times over the years. I sounded roughly the same in the rehearsal room as I did on small stage wagon. When other guys that I used to play with were out and playing (gigging) I used to work. So it was natural for me to search musical friends that were in the situation as me.

There is also a jargon that I don't like. I discovered that some hobby musicians were chasing money. They had good jobs and well paid as well. I don't mind persons that needs the money get paid. I just didn't have a good feeling when a pub/café owner had to pay me/us from his own pocket. There were just 10 persons that showed up ...... .

 

[Wade Cornell]

Questioning whether we are wanting, or ready to play in public is a worthwhile topic. Examples abound of various types like the shy individual who lacks confidence yet plays well and could possibly hide (somewhat) in a group/band. The opposite type is also easy to spot where it's all ego and not much music on offer. Between these two extremes there are lots of gradations coloured by the individual's ambitions, personality, training, equipment, age, physical appearance, and that elusive element nobody wants to talk about: talent.

Those who have performed and had a connection with their audience can experience something profound that can touch them deeply. It's natural to want to share this joy and encourage others to have that experience. It can also be "addictive" as a buzz that's like no other. I experienced this for the first time at age 14, even though I'd consider myself a shy type. Why is it that difficult? Well, obviously there is the fear of making a fool of ourselves along with a lack of confidence which under pressure can compound the likelihood of fluffing.

Is performing publicly for everybody? If they are forcing themselves to do so, are they as likely to experience a euphoric moment, or just be satisfied that they got through it... as an accomplishment with some degree of satisfaction?

(IMHO) there are two very separate issues of just being satisfied with an accomplishment as compared to having a connection with an audience. One is being on stage playing music, which others can hear, the other is reaching out beyond the stage and giving listeners a personal experience/communication.

All of the arts are about communication. Writing a manual isn't the same as writing a novel that enters your mind and brings thoughts, pictures and emotions. Music is no different as it can be presented precisely... like a manual, or it can be something that enters the listener's mind and evokes so much more. Great composers wrote music capable of this, but it still takes a great orchestra/band to deliver what's inherently possible.

If we are in the realm of improvisation, then it comes down to an individual's ability to GIVE those stories and emotions to an audience. Technical ability can allow us to deliver the goods, but too often technical ability is mistaken as the message rather then the means. This has been too long a discourse, so we'll just leave it there for anyone who has managed to get this far to ponder.

 

[BigMartin]

About the most enjoyable gig I've done since taking up the sax (as distinct form playing classical clarinet in my younger days) was as part of a one-night local festival. I won't name the area or band to protect the innocent (and the guilty, come to that). People could just wander in free and listen for as long as they wanted. We weren't a great band which meant that we seriously outnumbered the audience at any given time. But among the brave few were some small kids taking advantage of the space (there were no seats in the hall) to dance around, not caring about the quality of the music, just reacting to the rhythms. So much better than the usual polite applause from family members who had been dragged along.