Recommended glue for pearls?

[Profusia]

There was always a kid called Bostik, I never knew why.

Just don't ever shake his hand.

 

[Stephen Howard]

I suspect not real mother of pearl but can't be sure, but it's backed with something (blue)

It'll be plastic. There are several ways to test it but one of the simplest is to heat the tip of a needle up red hot then poke it into the side or the base of the pearl. If it goes in, it's plastic.

 

[turf3]

There was always a kid called Bostik, I never knew why.

And his buddy Lepage:

“They began to invent humourless, glum jokes of their own and disastrous rumours about the destruction awaiting them at Bologna.
Yossarian sidled up drunkenly to Colonel Korn at the officers' club one night to kid with him about the new Lepage gun that the Germans had moved in.
'What Lepage gun?' Colonel Korn inquired with curiousity.
'The new three-hundred-and-forty-four-millimeter Lepage glue gun,' Yossarian answered. 'It glues a whole formation of planes together in mid-air.'
Colonel Korn jerked his elbow free from Yossarian's clutching fingers in startled affront. 'Let go of me, you idiot!' he cried out furiously, glaring with vindictive approval as Nately leaped upon Yossarian's back and pulled him away.
'Who is that lunatic anyway?'
Colonel Cathcart chortled merrily. 'That's the man you made me give a medal to after Ferrara. You had me promote him to captain, too, remember? It serves you right.'
Nately was lighter than Yossarian and had great difficulty maneuvering Yossarian's luching bulk across the room to an unoccupied table. 'Are you crazy?' Nately kept hissing with trepidation. 'That was Colonel Korn. Are you crazy?'
Yossarian wanted another drink and promised to leave quietly if Nately bought him one. Then he made Nately bring him two more. When Nately finally coaxed him to the door, Captain Black came stomping in from outside, banging his sloshing shoes down hard on the wood floor and spilling water from his eaves like a high roof.
'Boy, are you bastards in for it!' he announced exuberantly, splashing away from the puddle forming at his feet. 'I just got a call from Colonel Korn. Do you know what they've got waiting for you at Bologna? Ha! Ha! They've got the new Lepage glue gun. It glues a whole formation of planes together in mid-air.'
'My God, it's true!' Yossarian shrieked, and collapsed against Nately in terror.”​

 

[jonf]

One of my favourite books, @turf3 At the age of 18 (that was forty years ago now) I read it in just two sittings, a novel of over 450 pages.

 

[DavidUK]

I use Bostik contact adhesive. The pearl can be removed again if needed. Not possible with super glue.

By the way, I found Locktite Extreme and Gorilla Glue super glues failed over a short period when applied to brass.

 

[PigSquealer]

It'll be plastic. There are several ways to test it but one of the simplest is to heat the tip of a needle up red hot then poke it into the side or the base of the pearl. If it goes in, it's plastic.

Some old units have Bakelite. The needle will go in with a awful smell.
I use this type of superglue. Great flow control with the squeeze apparatuses on sides. Clean the tip well before you put the cap on. Store in cool dark place. I’ve had bottles last a year or until empty. $6 for just about any brand.

 

[PigSquealer]

Ideally you shouldn't glue pearls in with any kind of permanent adhesive...in case you need to get them out again.

Fortunately I haven’t had the need to install or remove any real pearls. Many plastic ones though. Other than a crimp fit. What was the official old-school method ?

 

[thomsax]

What was the official old-school method ?

" Many repairmen replace the pearls in saxophone keys, and on valve instruments finger tips by merely glueing or shellacking the pearls into place. This was more or less a makeshift job, and does not really hold them. Sooner or later they will fall out and the customer will be disappointed in the the job and the repairman who did it. " (from "Band Instrument Repairing Manual" by Erick D. Brand, Copywright 1939, 1942, 1945, 1946).

The pearlholders on old saxes use to have "ring around the pearl". When pearl was removed from the holder you just insert a new pearl with a tight fit. After that the edge of the pearl holdr should be closed. So no adhedsive, gluing .. on old saxes? There is a tool for doing this. I have some pearls, pearl holders and pearl holder closing dies (set). I was going to be a sax repairman .

The pearls on my old saxes are fine. I have just replaced on or two pearls on saxes from the 20's. On student or modern saxes I used to glue in with shellack (clear).

 

[PigSquealer]

" Many repairmen replace the pearls in saxophone keys, and on valve instruments finger tips by merely glueing or shellacking the pearls into place. This was more or less a makeshift job, and does not really hold them. Sooner or later they will fall out and the customer will be disappointed in the the job and the repairman who did it. " (from "Band Instrument Repairing Manual" by Erick D. Brand, Copywright 1939, 1942, 1945, 1946).

The pearlholders on old saxes use to have "ring around the pearl". When pearl was removed from the holder you just insert a new pearl with a tight fit. After that the edge of the pearl holdr should be closed. So no adhedsive, gluing .. on old saxes? There is a tool for doing this. I have some pearls, pearl holders and pearl holder closing dies (set). I was going to be a sax repairman .
View attachment 26064
The pearls on my old saxes are fine. I have just replaced on or two pearls on saxes from the 20's. On student or modern saxes I used to glue in with shellack (clear).

Thanks for the information. Think I’ll stick to an adhesive when needed. Some thing about that tool approach to the different needs puts me off. I’m thinking it’s a very effective way to bend a key cup.

 

[thomsax]

Thanks for the information. Think I’ll stick to an adhesive when needed. Some thing about that tool approach to the different needs puts me off. I’m thinking it’s a very effective way to bend a key cup.

I'm not saying this is the way to deal with pearls. But I'm always interested how, and why, they were doing things in the old days. Shellack or hot glue, ....... screen cloth or chinois(e) ..... . We are all taking shortcuts but before that we must know how it should be by the book!?!?!

 

[greenstripe]

This is one of the traditional methods of mounting stones in jewellery and is often referred to as a 'rub-over setting' as in the edges of the metal are 'rubbed' over the stone. I doubt many modern saxophone manufacturers still use this method even if using real pearls, also adhesives have come a long way since your book was published.

Of course when dealing with vintage instruments where this was the original method, it's absolutely appropriate to repair in the same fashion.

 

[thomsax]

This is one of the traditional methods of mounting stones in jewellery and is often referred to as a 'rub-over setting' as in the edges of the metal are 'rubbed' over the stone. I doubt many modern saxophone manufacturers still use this method even if using real pearls, also adhesives have come a long way since your book was published.

Of course when dealing with vintage instruments where this was the original method, it's absolutely appropriate to repair in the same fashion.

The reason we still use "pearls" is that it look like the real thing and the are glued in. It cut hours.

The best "pearls" are brass or silver. Soft soldered instead of glued. It's an expensive way to deal with finger/key touches on saxes.

I'm a chef. It's so sad when they serve S:ce Bearnaise made as a S:ce Mayonnaise. Why? The want to make more money? The staff are lazy? They don't know how make the real thing? Sooner or later we accept the new standard ..... but it has nothing to do with the real thing.

 

[Colin the Bear]

A mop touch piece is less slippy when wet and can be dyed to taste.

The plating on plated touch pieces will wear away leaving bare brass. For some of us, with sensitive or acidic skin, bare brass is problematic.

 

[turf3]

" Many repairmen replace the pearls in saxophone keys, and on valve instruments finger tips by merely glueing or shellacking the pearls into place. This was more or less a makeshift job, and does not really hold them. Sooner or later they will fall out and the customer will be disappointed in the the job and the repairman who did it. " (from "Band Instrument Repairing Manual" by Erick D. Brand, Copywright 1939, 1942, 1945, 1946).

The pearlholders on old saxes use to have "ring around the pearl". When pearl was removed from the holder you just insert a new pearl with a tight fit. After that the edge of the pearl holdr should be closed. So no adhedsive, gluing .. on old saxes? There is a tool for doing this. I have some pearls, pearl holders and pearl holder closing dies (set). I was going to be a sax repairman .
View attachment 26064
The pearls on my old saxes are fine. I have just replaced on or two pearls on saxes from the 20's. On student or modern saxes I used to glue in with shellack (clear).

Well, epoxy was not commonly available when Erick Brand wrote that. For jobs like this, where gap filling capability is key, I'd only use epoxy. And it's SUPPOSED to be permanent. I can tell you that of the dozen or so saxophones I've owned with old fashioned crimped-in pearls I have never had to replace one and I've never had one come loose.

 

[turf3]

Thanks for the information. Think I’ll stick to an adhesive when needed. Some thing about that tool approach to the different needs puts me off. I’m thinking it’s a very effective way to bend a key cup.

You can't swage a pearl into place unless the receiver has been made to allow it. It needs a high thin rim that can be swaged down around the pearl to retain it. If it's meant for the pearl to be glued in, that won't be the case. Epoxy is your friend here.

 

[Colin the Bear]

Epoxy resin. Rubbish resin that you buy on line? 🤗

 

[turf3]

Epoxy resin. Rubbish resin that you buy on line? 🤗

I'm not sure what you mean; but for a pearl that needs refixing, I'd use ordinary clear hardware store epoxy. It's a low stress joint but the parts are not precisely matched - so you need something that fills gaps well.

 

[Marge]

Two layers of contact adhesive might be a little thick.
I hate Bostik. They used to call me that at school.

Why did they call you bostick?

 

[thomsax]

Well, epoxy was not commonly available when Erick Brand wrote that. For jobs like this, where gap filling capability is key, I'd only use epoxy. And it's SUPPOSED to be permanent. I can tell you that of the dozen or so saxophones I've owned with old fashioned crimped-in pearls I have never had to replace one and I've never had one come loose.

I just wanted to point outlaw they were dealing with pearls in the old days. I have owned some saxes that needed new pearls. They didn't fall out. They were discolored or worn out.

The question was also; "What was the official old-school method". I'm sure that were other methods back in the 1920's, 1910's .... . Not all saxes had pearls back then. Finger/key touches were often in brass.

 

[PigSquealer]

I just wanted to point outlaw they were dealing with pearls in the old days. I have owned some saxes that needed new pearls. They didn't fall out. They were discolored or worn out.

The question was also; "What was the official old-school method". I'm sure that were other methods back in the 1920's, 1910's .... . Not all saxes had pearls back then. Finger/key touches were often in brass.

1910 no pearls. A bit thin.

My 1916 Conn tenor is showing its age too.

Before service picture. Lower stack. Same Conn tenor.