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Saxophones Well well... my "new" Hanson is a Buffet 400!

DavidUK

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:shocked:

Just came off the phone to Alastair Hanson, who mentioned he is a consultant to Buffet.

The SA5 is a German bodied version of the Buffet 400. Interchangeable keys etc.
The SA5 Eclipse is a Chinese bodied version of the Buffet 400. Interchangeable keys etc.

Should be interesting to see how the latter compares to my Buffet 400 when it arrives next week.

You live and learn!

:)
 

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:shocked:

Just came off the phone to Alastair Hanson, who mentioned he is a consultant to Buffet.

The SA5 Eclipse is a Chinese bodied version of the Buffet 400. Interchangeable keys etc.

:)

I thought The Buffet 400 was already a Chinese bodied version of the Buffet 400
 

DavidUK

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I thought The Buffet 400 was already a Chinese bodied version of the Buffet 400

Yes it is, but it's not a Hanson.
I was pointing out the differences between the two Hanson models, but you knew that.... ;}
 

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So to simplify - the SA5 Eclipse is basically a Buffet-400 and the full SA5 is an improved version (a Super-Buffet 400) with a german made body (Keilwerth I wonder ?) . you may have found your dream sax in the SA5 ......

EDIT:- I wonder if the SA3 is a Buffet 100 then ?
 
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DavidUK

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So to simplify - the SA5 Eclipse is basically a Buffet-400 and the full SA5 is an improved version (a Super-Buffet 400) with a german made body (Keilwerth I wonder ?) . you may have found your dream sax in the SA5 ......
Mine's the Chinese bodied version. Alastair didn't mention any difference in quality between the two but you might assume that the German one would be better.

"The 'Eclipse' started life as a project to make a sax that would appeal to would be Yamaha customers; lighter, closer keys and cheaper than the standard SA5. By the time we had finished with it though we had added so many features in the engineering that it finished life as an SA5 variant which confused customers as to its market positioning and by the time we ended the project it was costing exactly the same as a standard SA5."

"The Eclipse has a long key guard instead of individual bell key guards, the centre brace is a different shape."
 

Saxdiva

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I'm not sure what a Hanson actually is. Just lots of copies that they say are copies. I tried to get specs for the pro altos. The web site only has one - an HA6. Supposed to be a combination of the best bits of Yanagisawa 991 and YAS62 at 1/3 price. (£899). But they make an SA6 for £1650. I can't see any difference in the spec, and they can't tell me, apart from, wait for it, it is modelled on a MKVI....

Even Selmer can't do that. See sax.co.uks latest video comparing ref 54 to MKVI. If they can't, I have doubts that parts made in Taiwan/China and assembled here can do any better.

I was then told it wasn't meant to sound like a MKVI, just feel like one under the fingers. A Yani 901 or equivalent Yamaha can do that, at around the same price as the Hanson. So given they say they keep it cheap by cutting out the middle man and the mark up, what has happened?

I have read great things about Hanson, but they are a bit evasive when asked pertinent questions.
 

DavidUK

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I'm not sure what a Hanson actually is. Just lots of copies that they say are copies. I tried to get specs for the pro altos. The web site only has one - an HA6. Supposed to be a combination of the best bits of Yanagisawa 991 and YAS62 at 1/3 price. (£899). But they make an SA6 for £1650. I can't see any difference in the spec, and they can't tell me, apart from, wait for it, it is modelled on a MKVI....

Even Selmer can't do that. See sax.co.uks latest video comparing ref 54 to MKVI. If they can't, I have doubts that parts made in Taiwan/China and assembled here can do any better.

I was then told it wasn't meant to sound like a MKVI, just feel like one under the fingers. A Yani 901 or equivalent Yamaha can do that, at around the same price as the Hanson. So given they say they keep it cheap by cutting out the middle man and the mark up, what has happened?

I have read great things about Hanson, but they are a bit evasive when asked pertinent questions.
I think they are in between websites at the moment: http://hansonmusic.co.uk/

Alastair said today that unlike TJ who bring in far eastern saxes and do final assembly here, Hanson are a "British Manufacturer".

Same as most remaining British car manufacturers I guess. They source parts for manufacture worldwide to their own spec, then assemble them here to make the finished product. That's as I understand the Hanson set up anyway.
 

Chris

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This thread could go the wrong way very quickly guys, just be careful what you post..

Thanks

Chris..
 

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Alastair said today that unlike TJ who bring in far eastern saxes and do final assembly here, Hanson are a "British Manufacturer".
.

Yes they are - of Clarinets ..... Most excellent clarinets I may add.

Where the saxes are made is a different matter, it would appear from your previous posts that they are Chinese or a mix of German and chinese, if the saxes are assembled here then how do they differ from TJ assembling them here ? . was any of the SA5-Eclipse assembled here or did it just roll off the same line as the buffet 400 ?
 

DavidUK

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This thread could go the wrong way very quickly guys, just be careful what you post..

Thanks

Chris..
Do you mean like my "My Carmichael is a BW" thread?

Assuming Alastair Hanson is a consultant to Buffet (and I've no reason to disbelieve him) and that he is connected to Hanson Saxophones, I think this is slightly different as it's confirmation from both manufacturers that a horn is basically the same.
 

DavidUK

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Yes they are - of Clarinets ..... Most excellent clarinets I may add.

Where the saxes are made is a different matter, it would appear from your previous posts that they are Chinese or a mix of German and chinese, if the saxes are assembled here then how do they differ from TJ assembling them here ? . was any of the SA5-Eclipse assembled here or did it just roll off the same line as the buffet 400 ?
Perhaps what he's saying is that TJ import the disassembled parts of a complete sax then re-assemble it here? I don't know.
What he is saying is that Hanson specify the parts to be made in Germany, Japan, China, Taiwan, bring these parts together in the UK and assemble their own creation. The main tube and keywork of the SA-5 is the same as the Buffet 400, the bell guard is different, as is the bell brace and I suspect some other minor detailing, engraving etc. But I think his point is that there should be a similarity of feel and sound from the Eclipse and my own 400. He said it will be interesting to see how I find them side by side.
 

DavidUK

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For the benefit of the site owner, could I modify my "is" in the topic title to "is very similar to".
Mods may physically alter the title if they wish.

Over keen again! :rolleyes:
 

jazzdoh

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I think they are in between websites at the moment: http://hansonmusic.co.uk/

Alastair said today that unlike TJ who bring in far eastern saxes and do final assembly here, Hanson are a "British Manufacturer".

Same as most remaining British car manufacturers I guess. They source parts for manufacture worldwide to their own spec, then assemble them here to make the finished product. That's as I understand the Hanson set up anyway.

I cannot see any difference here Hanson sources sax parts from all over the world and puts them together in Britain,as far as i can see so does TJ with its RAW and AS saxes.
I think its good to know that there is still two British companies that still do this.
 

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I cannot see any difference here Hanson sources sax parts from all over the world and puts them together in Britain,as far as i can see so does TJ with its RAW and AS saxes.
I think its good to know that there is still two British companies that still do this.

Neither can I, sounds to the same to me also ....

In fact the AS goes one massive stage further in that even the pillars etc aren`t soldered on, just the Raw parts arrive and have to be filed, soldered on and setup from scratch, I doubt the pads are fitted either. Dave Farley literally has to build the sax just as they would have if the bare bits had come from a UK Brass workers .

I don`t know what level Hanson do this, more likely the bodies & Bells come together with all the pillars and fixtures etc mounted and they put the keywork etc on is this right ?. if TJ are disassembling and re-assembling horns after they land, that`s actually more work (why not specify them in pieces ?), Hanson getting parts from all over the place would make receiving assembled horns not possible anyway .
 

Pete Thomas

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For the benefit of the site owner, could I modify my "is" in the topic title to "is very similar to".

Yes, just use the Go Advanced tab in the edit screen

Also can you please clarify what bits of what you say is reported directly and what is speculation. I'm concerned that it isn't very clear.
 
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DavidUK

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Re: Well well... my "new" Hanson is very similar to a Buffet 400!

Yes, just use the Go Advanced tab in the edit screen

Also can you please clarify what bits of what you say is reported directly and what is speculation. I'm concerned that it isn't very clear.

The following are reported directly from Alastair:

Post #1:
Just came off the phone to Alastair Hanson, who mentioned he is a consultant to Buffet.

The SA5 is a German bodied version of the Buffet 400. Interchangeable keys etc.
The SA5 Eclipse is a Chinese bodied version of the Buffet 400. Interchangeable keys etc.

Post #5:
In an email from Alastair: "The 'Eclipse' started life as a project to make a sax that would appeal to would be Yamaha customers; lighter, closer keys and cheaper than the standard SA5. By the time we had finished with it though we had added so many features in the engineering that it finished life as an SA5 variant which confused customers as to its market positioning and by the time we ended the project it was costing exactly the same as a standard SA5."

"The Eclipse has a long key guard instead of individual bell key guards, the centre brace is a different shape."

Post #7:
Alastair said today that unlike TJ who bring in far eastern saxes and do final assembly here, Hanson are a "British Manufacturer".

Post #11:
What he is saying is that Hanson specify the parts to be made in Germany, Japan, China, Taiwan, bring these parts together in the UK and assemble their own creation. The main tube and keywork of the SA-5 is the same as the Buffet 400, the bell guard is different, as is the bell brace and I suspect some other minor detailing, engraving etc.


 

DavidUK

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Re: Well well... my "new" Hanson is very similar to a Buffet 400!

Here are some photos....

408067820.jpg


408067819.jpg


408067818.jpg


408067817.jpg


408067816.jpg


408067815.jpg



Unfortunately the Hanson was not in good condition when it arrived and was unplayable due to the G# key hanging loose one end, plus other defects. I could have tried a few other notes but chose not to and it's gone back to the seller today for a refund. Maybe another time.

Anyway... spot the differences?
 

jazzdoh

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Re: Well well... my "new" Hanson is very similar to a Buffet 400!

Thanks David for clarifying this,only thing is your post 7 and post 11 contradict each other,just because Hanson brings in part from many countries,doesn't mean they do anything different than TJ.
 

jazzdoh

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Re: Well well... my "new" Hanson is very similar to a Buffet 400!

Very nice horns.



Here are some photos....

408067820.jpg


408067819.jpg


408067818.jpg


408067817.jpg


408067816.jpg


408067815.jpg



Unfortunately the Hanson was not in good condition when it arrived and was unplayable due to the G# key hanging loose one end, plus other defects. I could have tried a few other notes but chose not to and it's gone back to the seller today for a refund. Maybe another time.

Anyway... spot the differences?
 

DavidUK

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Re: Well well... my "new" Hanson is very similar to a Buffet 400!

Thanks David for clarifying this,only thing is your post 7 and post 11 contradict each other,just because Hanson brings in part from many countries,doesn't mean they do anything different than TJ.
Hi Brian, what TJ do I don't know. I'm just reporting Alastair's comments as told to me, i.e. he believes there is a difference in the way Hanson and TJ "make" saxes.
 
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