All profit supporting special needs music education and Help Musicians
SYOS

Saxophones Three German tenorsaxes

thomsax

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,807
I've been looking and buying German saxes the last years. My main saxes are still Martins. But you can buy nice saxes for less money. None of the saxes below cost over £ 300.00 and they were all in good condition and playable with some adjustments. Beside that there was also a good mouthpiece that came along with the sax.

1. Klingsor made by Hammerschmidt: Made in the mid 50's. Silverplated with rolled tonesholes. Double low octave vent. I installed new pads, corks and felts on this one. A good player but I would say it's a jazz-, ballad- or a classical-sax. Good intonation.
2. Diamond made by Döfler & Jörka: From c -63. Clearlaquer with nickelsilver keys. Rolled toneholes. The pads were workable. And I think it's been re-padded once. A good allround sax. Nice tone and quite powerful.
3. The New King made by Keilwerth: From c -68. Blacknickel laquer with goldlaquered keys. Original laquer?? If it's re-laquered it done by a pro! Big sound. A real Rocksax. I'm going to re-pad this sax. Original pads, so it's time for new pads.

So why buy new asian lowprice saxes when you can buy saxes like this for less money? The tone on these saxes are better than most modern asian saxes.


Thomas

View attachment 1272
 

thomsax

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,807
I agree. D&J used Keilwerth bodies for a long time.
Herr Dörfler und Herr Jörka were both former employeed at Keilwerth, Nauheim. They started thier own business and the tubes and bells were made by Keilwerth. D&J put thier own keys on the saxes. But they did thier own saxes as well. That means the saxes were copies of Keilwerth saxes. D&J was manufactoring stencilsaxes for companies/brand. SML among others!

I don't know if my D&J is a "Keilwerth". I can't use a - 62 neck from a Keilwerth tenor on the Diamond sax. I think Keilwerth bore/tube is bigger.

Thomas
 

gladsaxisme

Try Hard Die Hard
Subscriber
Messages
3,409
Hi Thomas

They look like 3 really nice saxes seems like you can get better saxes a lot cheaper over there than over here..john
 

jonf

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,680
Nice saxes, looks like you have done well. You do have to be careful with buying this sort of sax though. I had a Dorfler and Jorka briefly, and it had uneven tone holes. Getting this sort of problem rectified on a modern sax wouldn't be too big a deal, but on a sax with rolled tone holes it was not economic to get it fixed.
 

thomsax

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,807
Hi Thomas

They look like 3 really nice saxes seems like you can get better saxes a lot cheaper over there than over here..john
Hi John,

Nowadays the prices a quite low on saxes. But to be frank, German saxes beside Keilwerths are not so sought after.

Thomas
 

thomsax

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,807
Nice saxes, looks like you have done well. You do have to be careful with buying this sort of sax though. I had a Dorfler and Jorka briefly, and it had uneven tone holes. Getting this sort of problem rectified on a modern sax wouldn't be too big a deal, but on a sax with rolled tone holes it was not economic to get it fixed.
To buy a sax with rolled toneholes is always risky. I try to look for damages on or near the toneholes. To level a rolled tonehole is both difficult and expensive. As far as I could see without disassemble the toneholes seems to be even. But you never know before you take a closer look.

Thomas
 

thomsax

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,807
Nice horns, they look in great condition.

Brian
So far they are nice saxes and the condition is not bad for saxes at this pricelevel. But I consider these saxes to be intermediate. You know, I often meet former saxplayers that wants to take up the sax again, but don't want to spend so much money on a sax. So there is no really excuse for not start playing again!!

Thomas
 

jthole

Member
Messages
227
I'm surprised that you could find a Keilwerth New King for below 300 pounds! Sounds like a good catch!
 

milandro

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,483
I'm surprised that you could find a Keilwerth New King for below 300 pounds! Sounds like a good catch!
Some of these Tonekings can be found at a relatively cheap price since the market is what it is. I have one incredible metal Angel Wing alto (this one never had the lucite one but came out the production line like this) just overhauled from Tim Brennan (Johan Knows who he is) and I am keeping for the time being but sooner or later I will sell it.

Where can you find a Vintage horn in this state for a price that is more or less equal to a new Chinese made Yamaha 275?

 

kevgermany

ex Landrover Nut
Subscriber
Messages
21,947
These certainly aren't going that cheaply in Germany. If you're lucky you'll pick one up for about 500 euros. But it could esaily be more. Want one myself, but pennies are very tight...
 

kevgermany

ex Landrover Nut
Subscriber
Messages
21,947
you can find unknown Keiwerth stencils for relatively good prices......
yes, but no Angels wings.... Except for the odd D&J.

My teacher has a 70s Keilwerth Tenor, post angel wings. Wonderful sound. Better than his Kohlert Winnenden and, imho, his MkVI.... Fighting tallk I guess, but it's what appeals to me most.
 

milandro

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,483
true, but I have seen angel's wings (mostly silver or nickel plate with almost invariably a broken lucite wing) for as little as 250€ the problem is that if the price is that low their condition is such that if you have it restored at the same level of mine it would end up costing at least 1000€ (which is what I would want to sell mine for plus all the other costs).
 

kevgermany

ex Landrover Nut
Subscriber
Messages
21,947
true, but I have seen angel's wings (mostly silver or nickel plate with almost invariably a broken lucite wing) for as little as 250€ the problem is that if the price is that low their condition is such that if you have it restored at the same level of mine it would end up costing at least 1000€ (which is what I would want to sell mine for plus all the other costs).


It's worth it, but that's not an offer, sorry, unless I get lucky between now and when you want to sell.
 

milandro

Well-Known Member
Messages
2,483
Oh but I am not ready to sell it yet........ :) I am hanging on to it a while longer!

No I was just saying that one can find some Tonekings out there for a good price, the only caveat is to find them with straight toneholes! Unfortunately lots of them have collected bumps and bruises in time and if the tonehole has caved in a little it is very difficult to straighten out.
 
Top Bottom