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sax.co.uk

terre.de is it a legit site?

Pete Thomas

Chief of Stuff
Cafe Moderator
Messages
10,233
Location
Sunny Southampton
#1
Reason I'm asking, I just receive an email from them saying I had successfully signed up to an account. The email showed the account details and it had my full name, address, phone number

I have never heard of this site let alone signed up.

My best guess is they have my business card (probably from Frankfurt Musikmesse years ago) and manually created an account, which is annoying and contrary to any privacy laws I'm sure.

The reason I think it's that business card is that I changed my phone number a year ago, and I gave out quite a few of those old cards at Frankfurt when I was last there (probably 2014).

If it's a legit site I will contact them and give them a piece of my ind. If it's a spoof or scam site I'll just leave it alone.
 
Last edited:

MikeMorrell

Netherlands
Subscriber
Messages
753
Location
Breda, Netherlands
#2
Looks legit to me, Pete. They sell let's say 'New Age' musical instruments (and there's also a jewelry shop) The music shop is in Plauen, a town not far from Leipzig and Dresden. The shop is on Google maps and is listed in the local business directory. Their website looks legit and is hosted by a reputable German IT-company.

Probably, as you say, someone there typed the business cards they had into a 'customer relationship management system' (or Excel spreadsheet :) ). That usually happens to create/maintain lists. But creating a 'customer account' is a step too far!
You can reach them at:

Terré GmbH
Hans-Sachs-Str. 53
DE-08525 Plauen

Phone: +49-(0)3741-595329-0
Fax: +49-(0)3741-595329-22
Web: www.terre.de
Email: info@terre.de

Manager: Günter Riederer
 

jonf

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,517
Location
Betelgeuse
#4
Mike is right. Software systems - CRMs - such as SalesForce are used to manage clients and sales prospects. They can have plugins added which can scan and auto-load data direct from business cards.
 

Pete Thomas

Chief of Stuff
Cafe Moderator
Messages
10,233
Location
Sunny Southampton
#5
Yes I agree, I had assumed it was "legit" in that it isn't a malware site, but just wanted to check if anyone knew for sure. It certainly looks "legit" which I put in inverted commas because there is nothing legit about signing you up to an account from your business card, storing such info and now I just got an email so I'm also put on a mailing list, purely from them coming into possession of my business card or (worse), that card info being put on a database whose only purpose can be supplying that info to spammers. No doubt terre.de don't think of themselves as spammers but now that is exactly what they are.

I'm not even sure if it's now legal for companies to add you to a mailing list when you become a customer (apart from necessary info about your transactions). I think there is an EU requirement for double opt in (i.e. you opt in then confirm the opt in via email reply) as opposed to the way it used to be, i.e. being OK for anyone to put you on a list provided there is an opt out link on the email.
 
Messages
164
Location
Cambridgeshire
#6
The new GDPR (General Data Protection Regulation) comes into force in May 2018. It requires the marketer to prove they have your consent to contact you, and old records won't generally cut it. If they get no reply after 3 emails requesting consent (not sure over what timescale) they have to delete you from their database. So you could just leave it for now, then drop them in it come June next year...

Cheers

Jonathan
 

jonf

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,517
Location
Betelgeuse
#7
Current practice is pretty despicable, but I am pretty sure they will argue that as you gave them all your details, they have done nothing wrong.

GDPR is a pretty well thought through framework (one of the benefits of having been in the EU, and the way it has been adopted means that it is in existence come 2018 whether or not Brexit has taken effect by then). However, it will take a while for consent precedents to be set and case law to back up the statutory rules. Also, the Information Commissioner has made it clear that fines under the new regs will only be used as a last resort.

I'd suggest the best thing to do in the current circumstances is to send them a message asking for all your details to be removed from their systems, making it clear that any consent, implied or otherwise for them to hold your information has been withdrawn.
 

Pete Thomas

Chief of Stuff
Cafe Moderator
Messages
10,233
Location
Sunny Southampton
#8
but I am pretty sure they will argue that as you gave them all your details, they have done nothing wrong.
Well except that I didn't give them my details. They either got the business card from someone else (at Frankfurt I only ever handed them out to saxophone or accessory companies, never this type of thing, or else someone who got the card has put the details on a database that terre.de got hold of or purchased.
 

kevgermany

ex Landrover Nut
Cafe Moderator
Messages
20,550
Location
Just north of Munich
#9
I think you have to send an email saying desist, delete all my details and confirm it's been done. Also object that they've set up an account without you asking for it and ask them to explain why and on who's authority they did it. It might just be someone else masquerading as you.

Then depending on their reply consider what else you want to do. It might be something the German police are interested in, but it might not.
 

jonf

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,517
Location
Betelgeuse
#11
Well except that I didn't give them my details. They either got the business card from someone else (at Frankfurt I only ever handed them out to saxophone or accessory companies, never this type of thing, or else someone who got the card has put the details on a database that terre.de got hold of or purchased.
Ah, I misunderstood. Mind you, they'll probably still argue that you gave them the card, even if you didn't. I'd definitely write to them asking for your details to be removed.

I would be very surprised if any law enforcement agency would take action onthe basis of what has happened so far, annoying though it must be. Unless someone does start to use your details for some form of fraud it's hard to see there being any interest.
 

Pete Thomas

Chief of Stuff
Cafe Moderator
Messages
10,233
Location
Sunny Southampton
#12
Ah, I misunderstood. Mind you, they'll probably still argue that you gave them the card, even if you didn't. I'd definitely write to them asking for your details to be removed.

I would be very surprised if any law enforcement agency would take action onthe basis of what has happened so far, annoying though it must be. Unless someone does start to use your details for some form of fraud it's hard to see there being any interest.
I will write to them, and maybe suggest there has obviously been some serious identity theft so will be contacting Geman law enforcement. If they are just naïvely doing it thinking it's OK, then this should scare them a bit. If they are just cynically nicking my eats they won't care and as you say will probably argue I gave them the card.

It is a bit shocking, as this goes quite a bit beyond just email phishing what with my home address and telephone number (albeit an obsolete number thanks to BT losing it, but that's another story)
 

MikeMorrell

Netherlands
Subscriber
Messages
753
Location
Breda, Netherlands
#13
Pete.
I understand that you're angry about this but my advice is not to go 'over the top'. From what I've seen it's a small local shop that was just over-enthusiastic about building up an international customer base. They probably had no clue about German data privacy laws (in english). I seriously doubt whether they were aware that they were doing anything wrong.

I have no specialist knowledge on data privacy laws but they usually boil down to things like:
- is there a legitimate purpose for storing the information?
- is the information transparent? (does the person know what information is stored, why and how it is used? Can he/she adjust the information)
- is there protection is place to prevent the information being shared without the person's consent?

You can argue legalities or bring German law enforcement to bear but I suspect that if you point out that this practice is bad for business and ask for your account to be deleted, it will have just as much effect.

Just my opinion.

Mike
 

kevgermany

ex Landrover Nut
Cafe Moderator
Messages
20,550
Location
Just north of Munich
#15
I would be very surprised if any law enforcement agency would take action onthe basis of what has happened so far, annoying though it must be. Unless someone does start to use your details for some form of fraud it's hard to see there being any interest.
Except that here it's a criminal offense just to record the data without Pete's permission. They have to delete it if he tells them to. And the police have to take action if a complaint is made. The German police are very thorough.
 

jonf

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,517
Location
Betelgeuse
#17
Except that here it's a criminal offense just to record the data without Pete's permission. They have to delete it if he tells them to. And the police have to take action if a complaint is made. The German police are very thorough.
Morning, Kev, I was actually thinking more about the want of an evidence trail. If they argue that Pete gave permission by handing them a business card it's pretty hard to see what sort of action could be taken. If they refuse to delete his data once asked, that's a different matter, of course.
 
Messages
164
Location
Cambridgeshire
#19
Under the incoming GDPR mere possession of Pete's card will NOT be sufficient - they could have got that by any number of ways other than him handing it over, and even if he did it would (I believe) STILL require a SEPARATE evidence of his consent to put his details in any database. The onus is entirely on terre.de to PROVE they've complied with the regulation, not Pete to show they didn't.

I'd imagine any legit company will just go "whoops, sorry, we'll delete you right away", the rest will get clobbered until they mend their ways...