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Recommendations for imperial and metric tap and die sets please

saxmad

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Obviously a set needs to be small enough sizes to be able to work on saxes so any suitable places that sell sets will be most welcome.

Thanks in anticipation.
 

Stephen Howard

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1,959
I think you'll be better off buying them individually. Any set is likely to include more sizes that you'll never use rather than ones you will. Drill sets are much the same affair.

I should add - whatever you get, don't get carbon steel. Always go for HSS (high speed steel).
 

jbtsax

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8,009
I'm not sure where you live, but if you are in the U.S. these tap and die sets appear to be an excellent way to get started. For about $82 you can get many of the most used sizes. That would be the price of 2 or 3 dies if purchased separately.
 

gladsaxisme

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Are there a few thread sizes that tend to be used by most of the manufacturers and what are these and how do you find out what the thread is when you might need replace a rod
 

jbtsax

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The photo below shows what I use most of the time. I have one for metric and one for standard. The common ones include:
3 - 48, 2 - 56 Bundy, Cannonball, Conn
M3 x .5 Jupiter
M2.5 x .45 Mark VI, Yamaha
M2 x .4 Mark VI small

1599663587482.png
 

Colin the Bear

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Do Zeus still do their guide? Just googled it. They have it on amazon for £5.20. Zeus engineering charts. Pocket size and tough waxed paper. I've had mine for 40 years.
 

gladsaxisme

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Do Zeus still do their guide? Just googled it. They have it on amazon for £5.20. Zeus engineering charts. Pocket size and tough waxed paper. I've had mine for 40 years.
Yes they do I bought one a while back but there are hundreds of different types of threads in there and I wasn't sure how it all worked,
Think I might be getting old
 

gladsaxisme

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I have just been looking through my Zeus book and it doesn't seem to help you ascertain what thread you have when your looking at a rod with a thread on the end or am I missing something.
 

gladsaxisme

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The photo below shows what I use most of the time. I have one for metric and one for standard. The common ones include:
3 - 48, 2 - 56 Bundy, Cannonball, Conn
M3 x .5 Jupiter
M2.5 x .45 Mark VI, Yamaha
M2 x .4 Mark VI small

View attachment 15537
Thanks for the info very helpful I'm hoping the m numbers are metric do you have any sizes for Beuscher and King
 

gladsaxisme

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Thanks that Tracy tools is a great resource they seem to stock just about everything I have never managed to find anything like that on my searches
 
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rhysonsax

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I have just been looking through my Zeus book and it doesn't seem to help you ascertain what thread you have when your looking at a rod with a thread on the end or am I missing something.
Looking at a thread wouldn't be enough, you would have to measure the thread pitch and the Outer Diameter. Then you can look up what thread has those characteristics.

I haven't looked at a Zeus in probably 35 years - I wonder whether I could still find mine.

Rhys
 

jbtsax

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Thanks for the info very helpful I'm hoping the m numbers are metric do you have any sizes for Beuscher and King
Yes the M is for metric. I have a Buescher in the shop that I can remove a rod and check the thread size, but I am almost certain it is 3 - 48 since that size was common on U.S. made saxophones. The thing I find interesting is how Cannonball tries to be different that other brands from Taiwan by using larger hinge rods, and using standard threads instead of metric.
 

Colin the Bear

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13,079
Yes. Measure outside diamter of thread and use either a thread guage or a keen eye to count how many threads per mm/inch which is the pitch. Look up the diameter and pitch in the zeus tables to determine which it is. Metric, Whitworth, Ba, bastard etc.
 

gladsaxisme

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Just ordered a set of thread gauges not sure how much use they're going to be but they were only a fiver so not much lost.
When buying taps do you buy the full set of three or just the first two and I would imagine the dies are the most used but maybe not.
I will be looking at the app and thanks for all the info guys
 

jbtsax

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8,009
The only taps I have found a need for are the tapered ones. I do stock 2 or 3 of the smallest sizes because they tend to break easily. I suppose if one is tapping a hole for a small flat spring screw an end tap would be useful. I've only had to do that a few times but on keys thick enough that a deeper hole than needed could be drilled and tapped with a tapered tap.
 

Stephen Howard

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1,959
I tend to buy taps in sets of three (1st, 2nd, 3rd - or taper, second, plug or bottoming) - but that's because I often work with steels. For general horn work (in brass) you won't need a 1st or tapered tap - and you won't need a bottoming tap for anything other than tiny flat spring screw holes.
And after you've broken a few 2nd taps, you can always grind the tip flat (and put a tiny taper on it) to make your own bottoming tap. And if push comes to shove you can always grind a shallower taper on a second tap and turn it into a taper tap. And if you haven't got the right tap for the job, a BA tap will often get you out of trouble.

Be careful though, not every agrees on the numbering system - so choose them by name rather than number.
 

cromerblues

New Member
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22
Do Zeus still do their guide? Just googled it. They have it on amazon for £5.20. Zeus engineering charts. Pocket size and tough waxed paper. I've had mine for 40 years.
cor blimey!!! was just talking to someone the other day about the Zeus books!! I used to be in engineering and the very first paperwork we were given told to acquire were Zeus books and Log books.......pre calculator! THey had every thread you needed for the defence industry and crossed over from the myriad of older versions to the newfangled metric systems, even had French reverse threads!
 
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