Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interface?

[gilbertpz]

Hello,

I am trying to get a decent Audio dynamics and effects for my perfomance in live situations, so I am trying to investigate my options, cause I need real processing with NO delay time, to put my sax mic signal thru compresion, eq and effects and get it ready to feed the main audio console. So Would You share your experiences and knowledge about this?... Are recommending some audio interface in particular to use with a laptop or Do you know options like iRig Pre which would be work in this kind of situations?.

Thanks You all.;}

 

[aldevis]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

I haven't done it for years, but I used a digitech studio quad. If i had to do it tomorrow, I would probably still go for similar multi-effects rather than computers.
Latency is a serious issue: a machine will take at least 0.09 secs to understand that you are playing a low B on your tenor, before processing it. And I am not considering latency, yet.
There are interfaces that have elaborate functions of direct monitoring though. What kind of effects are you planning to use?

 

[gilbertpz]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

I haven't done it for years, but I used a digitech studio quad. If i had to do it tomorrow, I would probably still go for similar multi-effects rather than computers.
Latency is a serious issue: a machine will take at least 0.09 secs to understand that you are playing a low B on your tenor, before processing it. And I am not considering latency, yet.
There are interfaces that have elaborate functions of direct monitoring though. What kind of effects are you planning to use?

Sorry for the delay! 🙁

I hope to get eq, compresion and sometimes a little reverb or delay as need it for the permormance, but will be great to have the potential to include some harmonizing or doubling... Thanks you.

 

[aldevis]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

With a dynamic clip and some preamp, I used a thing like this:
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DigiTech-...l_Processors_Rack_Effects&hash=item35c857da9e
You need to work out the programming, but it is very versatile. I used it both as an insert and on an aux, at the same time.

I read about these two as recommended on saxophone, but haven't checked all the specifics.

http://www.tc-helicon.com/products/voicelive-play/
Deadlink Removed

 

[aldevis]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

Are you sure you really need compression?

 

[gilbertpz]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

Are you sure you really need compression?

Well I usually work on mixing live and in studio and Sound FOH and as part of the job I want to cover all the dynamics in the audio processing, so I need it? is a question of the moment, and maybe I have to give you the fact that I always want to keep experimenting... About the Vocal processing units, I think the will be a good options but maybe will be a little expensive, recently TC Helicon begin to produce some stompboxes that you can configure in chain as the guitarist does with the single pedals, they offer you a unit for dynamics, another for harmony and other for reverb, and several other options... each one is around $100, so if I want dynamics procession, harmony and reverb it will be around $300... Greetings!.

 

[aldevis]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

I personally try never to use compression live, but it is an aesthetic choice. I the reason is peak limiting, I quite enjoyed using a single valve preamp at the start of the chain (a cheap Beringher).

Keep in mind that reverbs are better stereo.

 

[tzadik]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

If you a manageble compression... you need a compressor.

Limiting is an infinite compression... not so useful on instruments.
Limiters are for preventing damages to other devices after the mixer (example: PA/loudspeakers).

Compression is a "science": you can use different types of compressions (serial or parallel) in different ways (with different techniques)... and get different results.

If you play in small clubs, compression can be near useless.

A good device from TC is the VoiceTone Create XT... it has reverbs, delays, a good preamp, and a "shaping" effect (which is basically an automatic compressor).

 

[aldevis]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

I the reason is peak limiting, I quite enjoyed using a single valve preamp at the start of the chain (a cheap Beringher).

If you a manageble compression... you need a compressor.

Limiting is an infinite compression... not so useful on instruments.

I am referring to those annoying digital peaks, 1ms that can annoy digital machines. A valve gives a mild analogic compression that limits the issue.

 

[gilbertpz]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

The matter and art of compression is very often a thing of personal taste and experience, but definitely the material you are playing and the dimensions of the performance in context with all the band will shape the objective of my compression approach... If I play in a Jazz context so traditional, that I will need to keep all my dynamic expression in front and so acoustic maybe then I won´t use more than a minimun compression but if I have a huge rock solo or a lot of altissimo loud notes in that solo keeping a Sax in a leash will add me control to the overall mix and give some presence, that´s what I've done sometimes with lead o back-up vocals. in this scenario I will go for more comp... But a truly soulful and tight Saxophone performer will be always better, that´s true... and by now I still in the long journey to get that kind of excellence as sax player... Thanks You all for your answers...

 

[gilbertpz]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

Hello... By the way, I just found an used unit of Digitech Vocalist 300 on around $52, which is a decent price in my country, so I will be posting my review of this unit for Sax applications. Greetings!!!.

 

[tzadik]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

Behringer (and other brands) cheap box which have a tube inside... they have the tube just like a lamp.
Anyway, for the price... they work good.


Real tube preamps are very expensive... and they are completely different.

The tube compression comes when you are near to overdrive the tube (same effect of overdrive guitar pedals). That 12AX7/ECC83 in those cheap box does only... light. But those cheap boxes tend to smooth up the sound a little bit though.


Never liked Digitech effect... they sound pretty fake, to my ears. Try it before buy.
To me, it's better to have one singles box with great quality sound (think TC VoiceTone Create XT) than a cheap box (like the Vocalist) which makes everything (including coffee and toasts) but with very cheap sound quality.

---
When I play pop/rock (and contemporary music in general), my goal is to have the right amount of compression and edge, that comes from me and my instrument and not from the signal path.

 

[aldevis]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

---
When I play pop/rock (and contemporary music in general), my goal is to have the right amount of compression and edge, that come from me and my instrument and not from the signal path.

This is the bottom line. It is very hard to use the full dynamic range on pop stages.
Just in case it can end up useful (we are talking about more than a decade ago), I used a small mixer (Mackie) with mono delays and harmonizers in insert and reverbs on aux.

L&R to the sound guy, praying he would not add anything.

 

[tzadik]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

If you think... on most large venue, you have at maximum 10/12 dB of dynamic range, you realize that years spent on practising are useless.

Reverbs have always to run in parallel, but most of revebers (and delays) have a parallel routing inside.
A personal mixer can be useful to simplify all the operations.


Password: super stereo!

 

[gilbertpz]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

Thank You for your concern, but is an used unit so inexpensive that I will do it as a part of my experimentation, while I move up and test another units in the next months, I am pretty sure this Vocal 300 won't be my final choice, and You are right about fake sound as I've heard youtube videos of people using this model I did feel exactly same concern for the lake of realism of Vocal 300. TC Helicon has all the flying colors to become my winner, with many options since their new single stompboxes for singer, passing by the VoiceTone units and final on the VoiceLive pedalboard or the VoiceLive Touch unit. So is a matter of take this inexpensive used Vocal 300 and used it as experimenting process and get to know exactly what I do not want and no need. I have to tell You that in the past I wrote to support service of Line6 and TC to let them know about there are plenty of Sax player around the world who will buy a processing unit designed only for our saxes.

 

[gregerhillman]

If you got a MacBook and a basic sound card, like m-audio or maybe a more premium option like Apogee, then you are good to go if you've got Logic Studio.

I know it cost a bit to get that software from apple, but it's great.

In the bundle that comes with LS is a program called Mainstage. It's designed for live performances and can be programmed to your needs.

I use it a lot for sax as well as for keyboards, backtracks and loops.

So, what you need is
1. Mic
2. Sound card USB or FireWire
3. Apple computer
4. Mainstage (included with Logic Studio)

As far as latency goes, set sample rate to 64 in the settings and you are ready to go.

Hope that helps!
Play On!
//Greger

 

[gilbertpz]

Re: Live processing?... is it really possible with a mobile device or an audio interf

If you got a MacBook and a basic sound card, like m-audio or maybe a more premium option like Apogee, then you are good to go if you've got Logic Studio.

I know it cost a bit to get that software from apple, but it's great.

In the bundle that comes with LS is a program called Mainstage. It's designed for live performances and can be programmed to your needs.

I use it a lot for sax as well as for keyboards, backtracks and loops.

So, what you need is
1. Mic
2. Sound card USB or FireWire
3. Apple computer
4. Mainstage (included with Logic Studio)

As far as latency goes, set sample rate to 64 in the settings and you are ready to go.

Hope that helps!
Play On!
//Greger

Great advice, thank you for get it all in order!!!...