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Lets Talk about Embouchure!

Ponce Julius

Member
Messages
56
I play with the traditional bottom lip tucked, top teeth on the mp embouchure...but my music teacher plays with with what he calls a classical embouchure and he doesn't want me to play this way cause he says I'm not ready. Of course I tried it out anyway when I'm practicing alone and I noticed that I'm able to play louder with a little more control....What type of embouchure do you prefer and why? I attached a link to illustrate his embouchure. I play with the traditional picture in Fig 6, my music teacher plays like the picture in Fig 5.

http://tamingthesaxophone.com/saxophone-embouchure.html
 

Gandalfe

Member
Messages
107
I currently have two sax instructors and work with pro's on a case by case basis to get more feedback. I have never had an instructor that I agreed with 100% of the time. Do what feels right for you unless the evidence is overwhelming pro in one way. For example, I wish I had never been taught the one and one Bb fingering. But then I'm guessing my 5th grade band teacher was a trombone player.
 

daveysaxboy

Big ruff Geordie bendy metal blower
Messages
3,312
I got taught for about 6 years with my teacher with my bottom lip tucked in,i call it the old fashioned way many years ago untill i went to music college and they made me change to the what they called the modern way,bottom lip out,the reed just sits on the lip,a touch out.The 1st few weeks was hell but it came.I seen many old timers playing with the lip in,check out the modern guys,nearly all got it out.I think your more relaxed that way.
 

Sunray

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,708
Decision Time ...

Hey Mate ...

It's your Lip ... Your Sax ... Your Choice ... :w00t:

You do what you find works for you ...

After all - Your teacher can't imprison you ... :)))

Have loads of fun ... ;}
 
Messages
509
I used to play using the classical embouchure but found that when i was playing rock, i would end up with a deep painful groove inside my top lip.
ok if you are playing infrequently enough for it to heal between gigs, but otherwise a no no
 

kevgermany

ex Landrover Nut
Subscriber
Messages
21,947
I was having problems with lower lip curled in, I started pushing it out, and the difference was noticable - more control and much better sound, but... It's difficult switching as you need a lot of strength in that lip.
 

daveysaxboy

Big ruff Geordie bendy metal blower
Messages
3,312
I was having problems with lower lip curled in, I started pushing it out, and the difference was noticable - more control and much better sound, but... It's difficult switching as you need a lot of strength in that lip.
Just go with lip out and stay that way,its hard for a while but once done your sorted.As for strength i think you use alot less stress and strength on the lower lip using the modern method once its mastered but as with all reed instruments you need to keep playing as much as possible,every day if you can,miss a week and the old lip can tell.
 

Gallen

Senior Member
Messages
397
Was 6, teacher switched over to 5. Took several weeks to get it stabilized. Can't say good or bad as I was pretty new to sax when I found my teacher.
 

TomMapfumo

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,219
Lip out for me too, as several folks have highlighted, but maybe quite a few folks start with lip in as they try to build an embouchure. Playing trumpet is an awesome way of building the muscles in your lip. If you can't frown when playing sax, when can you frown in this excessively happy world........................;}
 

Fraser Jarvis

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,910
I use what the experts call a double lip embouchure, works for me and gives me the control and sound i like (i heard Coltrane used this) so i guess if it was good enough for him....
 

Nick Wyver

noisy
Subscriber
Messages
5,949
(i heard Coltrane used this)
You didn't hear very well then...

<edit> ok, sorry, I've found a reference that he switched to a double embouchure later in life when he had teeth trouble. All the pics of him I can find at the mo show a single lip emb.

Which makes me think: If you're trying to sound like Coltrane in '67, what sort of music do you play? ;}
 
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kevgermany

ex Landrover Nut
Subscriber
Messages
21,947

Fraser Jarvis

Well-Known Member
Messages
1,910
You didn't hear very well then...
No i don't hear so good, partialy deaf + two hearing aids, ha ha...
Which makes me think: If you're trying to sound like Coltrane in '67, what sort of music do you play?
No i don't sound like Coltrane, or for that matter even want to sound like him, i'm trying to develop a tonal concept as close as i can to Roland Alphonso but with the fluidity of Cedric Brooks, and ultimately the control and range of Earl Bostic, thats in an ideal world of course and as we all know the reality can be quite different! and as for what music do i play, well my avatar may give you a clue.....
Back to the double lip embouchure though, when i started playing it just kind of felt right for me, i just presumed that was how you blew not even having heard the word embouchure before...
 

TomMapfumo

Well-Known Member
Messages
5,219
Like Nick Wyver I am also influenced by the advanced tonal concept of the famous Welsh Saxophonist, Dai Evostik, and the fluidity of Marston Pedigree and Samuel Smith, who used to feature on the local pub circuit in the northern UK before becoming more popular commercially in the rest of the UK....
 
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