Tone or Sound How to growl on saxophone

[Chris98]

To achieve the famous saxophone growl just hum or sing as out of tune as possible whilst playing – finally, something I naturally do becomes an advantage!

Easy, no problem I had my copy of HL ‘Vol. 105 - Soulful Jazz’ opened at Harlem Nocturne, I checked for the glow of the blue lights on the back of my 75W bi-amped monitors and then hit play in iTunes, the backing track thumped out with reassuring authority and I prepared myself for the much anticipated sleaziest and most raucous of tones to ensue like liquid out of my beloved tenor…

…What I got sounded like a spluttering of lumpy gravy crossed with an angry duck and I was left wondering where all my air had gone. Teething problems I assured myself. I did a quick hum without the saxophone and was mightily impressed with just how out of tune it was, and so it was with renewed enthusiasm I tried again, and fared little better.

What gives? I have the ideal tune to perfect this most desirable of saxophone tones and yet it seems elusive, the humming mechanism seems to get bypassed as soon as I have a mouthpiece in my mouth!

 

[half diminished]

Check this out. http://tamingthesaxophone.com/saxophone-growl.html

 

[Taz]

One thing I can do quite nicely (to my ear anyway) is to growl.
Chris, you are on the right track, coughing, spluttering and almost choking are all par for the learning curve. Suddenly realising that your air stream is apparently traveling in the wrong direction is only natural. Keep at it. To start with it'll sound awful, after a few weeks, you should have the start of something a tad more useful. After about a month, you should be able to give the great Earl Bostic a run for his money!

 

[rudjarl]

…What I got sounded like a spluttering of lumpy gravy crossed with an angry duck and I was left wondering where all my air had gone. Teething problems I assured myself. I did a quick hum without the saxophone and was mightily impressed with just how out of tune it was, and so it was with renewed enthusiasm I tried again, and fared little better.

What gives? I have the ideal tune to perfect this most desirable of saxophone tones and yet it seems elusive, the humming mechanism seems to get bypassed as soon as I have a mouthpiece in my mouth!

Hi Chris,
I think you actually may have had a good start at it. If the sound changed, then (at least) something happened. I have tried to achieve the growl for a while now, but I get nothing. Just a plain unchanged tone. I think that all you need to do is (sorry for using the boring word here) practice it a few days.

 

[wemeetagain]

Check this out. http://tamingthesaxophone.com/saxophone-growl.html

the baritone growl is one of the coolest sounds i have ever heard!!!!

 

[dooce]

As I understand it, the "growl" is the result of the harmonic interference patterns between the sound waves coming from your throat and the vibrations of the reed - or I might be completely wrong, but that's how it feels to me. When I started doing it I thought it would be the same as humming into a flute, where you follow the melody with your humming a la Ian Anderson etc, but the sax works completely differently - I just keep a low hum going, somewhere round low E or D. When you are playing close to those notes though, there is little difference in the 2 sets of vibrations so the growl gets much weaker. The answer is to pitch the hum even lower, or higher, to re-establsh the difference in wavelengths.

I may have just written the definitive insight into saxophone growling technique, or more likely, a load of unscientific and unsubstantiated tosh..........

🙂))🙂))

 

[JTMaul]

My sax tends to make something resembling a growl whenever I get down to bottom C. But I don't think it's what you're asking about.

 

[johnboy]

Am I missing something here - growl & edge. My understanding of the growl, was that you made a hawking motion in your throat, (thats what works for me),while edge was achieved by singing/humming?

John.

 

[Fraser Jarvis]

What i do is to loosen my embouchure slightly and make a kind of "uuuuur" noise from my throat down the sax, by the way mouthpieces make it easier/harder as well, i find it most easy on my Floridated 9* link, easy'ish on my Lawon 10b and quite difficult on my newly aquwired Guardala 9*
B.T.W. as far as efects go i found this much easier to establish than say, vibrato, altissimo etc but i know for other people it can be the other way around, good look.

 

[SaxyMalcolm]

Can some one help me figure out how to growl? I've tried the humming/singing thing and that did nothing. Is there an embouchure or air change that I need to make? or do I just need to sing louder?

It might be because I am Scottish but I found growling easy, just sing Grrrrr... into the instrument, a bit like clearing your throat. It might be easier if you get your throat/aural chamber in the correct shape for the particular note you are playing. Say play a low G, then sing the same note with the best singing voice you have, really open your throat so you get a nice tone, then keeping the shape, Grrrrrrrrr and play the G.

It works for me

Malcolm

 

[compound]

The only methods i know for Growling are, 1. Humming while you play the note, 2. Using your throat, as if your clearing it, the second example i wouldn't use as it can make your throat sore. I use method 1. which once you get the hang of it you will never lose it. Just Hum as you play and it will come, you have just got to keep at it, it took me week's and all of a sudden it was there.
Best of luck. Rob.

 

[John Laughter]

Maybe some of this will help;

I have used the “hum” technique to produce the growl since 1956. Both the growl and the “flutter tongue” were very popular techniques used by sax players in Rock & Roll and R&B music which was hitting the airwaves in the late 50s. Those of us who joined the local school band and liked the new music were asking the band director what this new “gritty or raspy” sound was that we were hearing on the Top 40 hits featuring Lee Allen and Grady Gaines on tenor and Earl Bostic on alto. This effect was used before the 50s and is still very popular in many forms of music. The 1985 hit Rockin' at Midnight by The Honeydrippers features Keith Evans using a lot of this technique in his tenor solo.

There are other ways to achieve the growl effect from what I have read on the NET over the years but I have only used the method of humming while playing a note to get the growl tone.

I suggest that the best way to learn this technique is to start with the mouthpiece attached to the neck. If you use the entire horn it can be a problem at first due to the coordination involved. Play a note on the neck then start “humming” a note that is higher or lower than the pitch that is coming out of the neck. Some players hum in a falsetto range to get above the note that is produced by the neckpiece. Some players will sing/hum a lower note. For example, when I play a G above the staff on tenor I find that I usually hum the pitch that is close to D below the G. If you hum the same pitch that is coming out of the neckpiece or sax the effect will be cancelled.

At first you may feel that it is taking a lot of air to play and hum at the same time on the neckpiece. This is natural because you will probably open your throat and exhale too much air as a result of your efforts to hum and exhale at the same time. Easier said than done at first! In time you will learn to control the amount of hum and the coordination will become natural. Now put the horn together and see what happens.

Many of us use the growl in the middle and high range, especially from high A above the staff to high F#. I have found that the most effective area for the growl is starting on 2nd space A of the staff and upward. Once you go below 2nd line G it becomes somewhat garbled.

I have read articles that suggest that you hum a 3rd above the note being produced on the horn. However, while on stage during a rockin’ performance I can’t hear the note that I am humming due to the stage volume. I have never thought about the “3rd above” concept so I can’t comment on it however if it works for you that is all that matters. I hum in a range that is usually below the notes being played which works for me.

As you practice this effect ask for more advice from other local sax players and review articles on the internet. This is valuable because there is always more than one way to approach any effect.

Several examples. Cut and paste on YouTube;

LET THE GOOD TIMES ROLL—SHIRLEY AND LEE—LEE ALLEN—TENOR

SLIPPIN’ AND SLIDIN’—LITTLE RICHARD—LEE ALLEN—TENOR

KEEP A KNOCKIN’—LITTLE RICHARD—GRADY GAINES—TENOR

SUPER FREAK—RICK JAMES—DANIEL LE’MELLE—TENOR

UNCHAIN MY HEART—JOE COCKER—CLARENCE CLEMONS—TENOR

THE HEAT IS ON—GLEN FREY—DAVID WOODFORD—TENOR

ROCKIN’ AT MIDNIGHT—HONEYDRIPPERS—KEITH EVANS—TENOR

HARDEN MY HEART—QUARTERFLASH—RINDY ROSS—ALTO

FREEWAY OF LOVE—ARETHA FRANKLIN—CLARENCE CLEMONS—TENOR

Other links for the growl;

The saxophone growl - a lot easier than you think if you follow this guide

Saxophone Frequently Asked Questions

Rock & Roll Sax - Book/CD Pack Hal Leonard Online

http://www.saxophone.us/sax/saxophone_growl.html

http://www.saxophone-players.com/howtoplaythesaxophone-growling.html

 

[Taz]

I've always found it impossible to do the flutter tongue properly, so I cheat (like I do for most thing's really,) try rolling your r's (please refrain from any attempt at humour OG) I find that it works really well, and during Brown sugar, you can do that as well as hum. The results are superb!

 

[Martin]

OK, so in my whole life I've never been able to roll my R's...problem!

My wife, laughing at my efforts took pity on me and coached me to roll R's. She's Portuguese, so she's a natural. At first I didn't believe I'd suceed, but after only two days I mastered it. Now I can do I really proficient RRRRRR, without the sax....thanks to my Latin lover...

So the next step is with the sax...made a start this evening...not easy...cuts on the end of my tongue. It seems pretty difficult to play a note at the same time as doing the RRRRRR thing, but I think it'll come....I'll let you know.

Cheers,
Martin

 

[thomsax]

Hi Rawr,
The only methods i know for Growling are, 1. Humming while you play the note, 2. Using your throat, as if your clearing it, the second example i wouldn't use as it can make your throat sore. I use method 1. which once you get the hang of it you will never lose it. Just Hum as you play and it will come, you have just got to keep at it, it took me week's and all of a sudden it was there.
Best of luck. Rob.

Right. But you can also learn to "growl" more up in your head (like an operasinger). I think it's the same as "3rd above" as John Laughter writes. It's better for your troat. Andrew Clark, Rock & Roll Saxophone - Saxophone Journal , had to learn this method after a throat surgery. Even the ordinary growl can be hard to your troat.

Thomas

 

[thomsax]

Martin, take a look at John Laughter's post - humming does it as well.

I don't think the "growl" can replace the "fluttertone". You can growl, hum, sing-along .... all the time if you want but (but you shouldn't) even when you do the fluttertone, heavy vibrato, big hollow shake ..... . The rapid "snaredrum effect" can just be done with the fluttertone. Anyone heard a "fluttertone thrill" or a "fluttertone tremolo"? Is it possible to do that? Or is the fluttertone just a single tone effect? I'm asking because I can't to any fluttertone at all.

Thomas

 

[Martin]

Martin, take a look at John Laughter's post - humming does it as well.

Thanks Kev, but I've already got a pretty mean growl. What I hope for is also to be able to do the flutter tongue....seems like it gives something similar, but way more exagerated. I'm hoping, with a bit of practice, to be able to play either.

I play Rebel Rouser regularly, using a growl, but it doesn't quite get dirty enough...I really need to perfect the flutter....

....practice, practice, practice....

Martin

 

[compound]

Hi Pete,
I always growl (clear my throat), which is slower than when I hum, which is more like a buzz . I use both during solos, the growl being for a couple of notes and the hum for a bit longer but only use them for parts of a solo ;}

John.

Hi John,
I've got the Steve Douglas video " Rock and Roll Saxophone " and he demonstrates the clearing the throat type of growl as just another type of growl if you can't hum. He doesn't recomend it as it can make your throat sore.
Hope your good lady is on the mend.
Kind regards Rob.

 

[johnboy]

Hi John,
I've got the Steve Douglas video " Rock and Roll Saxophone " and he demonstrates the clearing the throat type of growl as just another type of growl if you can't hum. He doesn't recomend it as it can make your throat sore.
Hope your good lady is on the mend.
Kind regards Rob.

Hi Rob,
Yes thanks, Carole is feeling o.k.
We are coming back to the U.K. next week to check on the car and boat (no cruising this year(blast)). Will pick up some reeds and get along back here as soon as possible!!!
Back to topic. I always new that I was wierd, when I hum it's a completely different sound to my throat growl, it's more of a buzz.
I never have had any problems with my throat, but then I dont growl all the time in solos (less is more) I don't buzz much for the same reason. Of course with the fabulous 'Metalite', I let the edge do most of the talking (I thought you'd like that ;}).
What I will do before Christmas, is record the two sounds and see what others think.
Keep up the good work and may your carbons fly true!

John.

 

[compound]

OK, so in my whole life I've never been able to roll my R's...problem!

My wife, laughing at my efforts took pity on me and coached me to roll R's. She's Portuguese, so she's a natural. At first I didn't believe I'd suceed, but after only two days I mastered it. Now I can do I really proficient RRRRRR, without the sax....thanks to my Latin lover...

So the next step is with the sax...made a start this evening...not easy...cuts on the end of my tongue. It seems pretty difficult to play a note at the same time as doing the RRRRRR thing, but I think it'll come....I'll let you know.

Cheers,
Martin

Hi Martin,
If your getting cuts on your tongue your halfway there, at least you can roll your RRRRs with the mouthpiece in thats half the battle. I can roll all day till the mouthpiece goes in then nothing. By the way King Curtis doesn't flutter tongue on Honky Tonk like Clifford Scott, i've heard a lot of player's who dont, maybe they can't.?
As a matter of interest what effects are you using when you play?,It sounds very pro.
Anyway mate it wont be long before your doing it, and i cant wait to hear the results.
Very best of luck. Rob.