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gladsaxisme

Try Hard Die Hard
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3,441
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manchester
I have just embarked on a rebuild overhaul of one of my old alto saxes I have acquired from eBay in the past, it's a KING by H N WHITE and after doing some lacquer removal on the Bell a name has now appeared which might be Cleveland but it isn't all there it has been shortened Clev,d and under that there is an O or D

The bell to body brace has been badly knocked into the body and there are various dents and pillars knocked in also plus a number of the wire key guards have been damaged "twisted out of shape" and knocked into the body here and there.

So far I have removed all the keys they came off quite easily with non of the rods seized or rusted in any way and also the rollers were free running too so all in all not bad condition apart from the dents mentioned earlier, I have removed the wire guards,thinking they will be easier to straighten off the sax rather than on it and also the dents where they fit to the body should be easier to sort with them off, I used a pencil torch to remove these,

Now I intend to dismantle the three sections to get better access to repair the various dents as I don't have any of the special tools that I know are available but a bit expensive for a one off.One of the things I would like to know is,is it better to use a larger torch when heating to separate these parts " I do have a plumbers gas torch "and is the connecting ring a separate entity or connected to one of the other parts, is it best to mark the parts in some way to insure correct alignment when putting back together and what's the best way to do this.

I will be most grateful for any advise offered by our technician members, thanks in anticipation ......John
 
Last edited:

jbtsax

Well-Known Member
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Beautiful Springville, Utah USA
You've taken on quite a project! First of all there should be just two major parts, the body tube and the bell/bell bow section. It is important to scratch a line that goes from the body across the junction to the bell bow in order to realign the parts exactly when reassembling. When soldering/unsoldering the bell bow connection it is helpful to have a bit larger flame and to keep the flame moving around the circumference till the part gives. It is important to wire down any posts in the area so they don't come off due to the heat. Sometimes it works to wrap a wet cloth around them to absorb the heat.

To push up the dents in the body requires a steel ball on the end of a long rod that is held in a vice. Hopefully you can acquire or make a tool for this purpose. Techs use a threaded rod with balls of various sizes that screw onto it to address dents and dings of different sizes.

The best advice I can give a novice to repair is to have a backup plan for when (not if) you get in over your head. I have repaired professionally for several years now, and I still have my "go to guy" for when I get stuck on something I have not done before.
 

Taz

Busking Oracle
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3,668
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Rugby UK
Blimey John, you don't do things by halves do you!!!! Good luck mate. I think your going to need it!
 

MMM

Senior Member
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1,040
Locality
SW of London Town
Taking it apart is easy, it's putting all back where it should go (after the dent work), that is the tricky bit!
Prop you plumbers torch on a table so you can use both hand to move the sax body around and pull the main body from the bell apart.
Get yourself some heavy leather gardening gloves to hold the sax parts.
First unsolder the body to bell brace: doesn't matter which part comes off first (I mean the body end or the bell end (!)), then (after marking as JBTSAX said earlier) heat up the ring/bow section (it's a big flame so keep it some way away and protect pillars or other parts you don't want to come unsoldered, I use a few layers of thick kitchen foil to protect parts, but the wet rag also works well) at the body's end and pull the body and bow/bell section apart: done!
Then you'll have to tackle the dent work: remove any solder from where you need to take a dent out (for example, under the body/bell brace or under pillars), so it will make taking the dent out easier and have it ready for re-soldering....

If you want to make yourself some cheap dent tools, look into creating a bend into a 15 - 20mm 6steel rod (you can use this raised bit to work on the dent from inside the body) and cutting off the excess: if you go to a local garage, they can do the bending/cutting for little money if you supply the steel rod (you can see an example of this on the VOTAW website), you will obviously have to polish the tool to a high shine, so you don't scratch the inside of the sax. By varying the angle of the bend, you can make yourself quite a few different tools to cater for different dents. The reason I like these is because the curve is much shallower than that of a dent ball, so less prone to mistakes!
Hope this helps a little!
M.
 

gladsaxisme

Try Hard Die Hard
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3,441
Locality
manchester
Thanks to both John and mmm for your advice I have no doubt I'll be asking more as things progress, I'm a bit surprised you say only two sections John I thought you could take it right down to the three as I have seen someone do this on a you tube video, no one has said wether the rings are a part of the sections or a separate ring on its own, I had wondered about the other parts dropping off as you heat the joints so will try to wrap a wet cloth round,

Thanks for the info on the tool to make to tackle the dents I will be looking at the site you mentioned, I have already mentioned this to a metal worker friend of mine, I had considered having a tapering hard wood rod the same size as the body made up, can you tell me is the taper the same for tenors and alto's and just longer on the tenor or are they completely different.

I have already cleared the solder off the parts and body where I have removed them but left a thin tinning coat for better joining when reassembling, we used to put a tinning coat on something's when doing joints when I worked as a plumber way back when.

The fall back plan is kept outside it's called a bin but it's only a last resort if all else fails and I'm sure you guys will guide me through .

If I do a video can I send it to you Taz to do the commentary, I have already done a bit of it but hated my voice on it .

Bye for now......John
 

gladsaxisme

Try Hard Die Hard
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3,441
Locality
manchester
Good luck John :)

Jx


Thanks Jeanette

What is it they say fools rush in where angels fear to tread or something like that, my motto is where there's a will there's a way,and when the will runs out there's always the bin ......John
 

Tenor Viol

Full of frets in North Shropshire
Café Supporter
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Whitchurch, North Shropshire UK
I am eagerly anticipating the expletive deleted postings to come... :D
 

gladsaxisme

Try Hard Die Hard
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3,441
Locality
manchester
I am eagerly anticipating the expletive deleted postings to come... :D

OOOHHHHH NNNNOOOOHHHH NNNNNNOOOOHHHHH NNNNNOOOOOHHHHH I shan't be doin none of that it's fun working on saxes though I have been known to use the odd expletive whilst working on my car ......John
 

ProfJames

Elementary member
Messages
12,069
Locality
Berkshire, UK
Once you have done this project John you can then run courses from your home.
 

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