Tutorials

Discussion re BOTM/SOTM and beginners

Keep Blowing

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Now a word for those who have never managed to screw up the courage to post a recording, have a go. You will only receive encouragement, and if you ask for it others will put their tutoring hats on. The coach's job is to encourage and improve, not knock down.
I think what you have written above is spot on, I think i have suggested this before but,
Can this same thread be run simultaneously with the beginners recordings thread. Some members seem to be on the brink of posting something but just don't quite make it
 

Rob Pealing

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I think what you have written above is spot on, I think i have suggested this before but,
Can this same thread be run simultaneously with the beginners recordings thread. Some members seem to be on the brink of posting something but just don't quite make it
I understand the reluctance of beginner to post to the BOTM/SOTM threads and I was at one time . However as I understand it the difference between the beginner recordings thread and the BOTM, SOTM, and improvisation threads is that people who are not members cannot see/hear the beginner ones. (Moderators please put me right if this is incorrect) I really do not think this makes any difference, non members cannot make comment, either informed or ill informed, on the BOTM/SOTM etc.,
I have been a member for about 4 years and have never seen derogatory comments about another members playing, at a personal level I have received nothing but encouragement and help. It is clear that the more experienced players remember their early days.
I think the beginners thread would be better for recordings other than BOTM etc, indeed it is used for that sometimes. It would need a new title.
 
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I understand the reluctance of beginner to post to the BOTM/SOTM threads and I was at one time . However as I understand it the difference between the beginner recordings thread and the BOTM, SOTM, and improvisation threads is that people who are not members cannot see/hear the beginner ones. (Moderators please put me right if this is incorrect) I really do not think this makes any difference, non members cannot make comment, either informed or ill informed, on the BOTM/SOTM etc.,
I have been a member for about 4 years and have never seen derogatory comments about another members playing, at a personal level I have received nothing but encouragement and help. It is clear that the more experienced players remember their early days.
I think the beginners thread would be better for recordings other than BOTM etc, indeed it is used for that sometimes. It would need a new title.
I think you are right in what you say,. Presumably the beginners thread is done that way to encourage them to post their recordings,, if the beginners thread could run alongside the BOTM and the SOTM that's got to be a good thing. I was thinking of starting a thread and suggesting this, so please feel free to move it elsewhere
 

Rob Pealing

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I think you are right in what you say,. Presumably the beginners thread is done that way to encourage them to post their recordings,, if the beginners thread could run alongside the BOTM and the SOTM that's got to be a good thing. I was thinking of starting a thread and suggesting this, so please feel free to move it elsewhere
Those who are shy could put it in the beginners recordings with a link from here however I really do not think there is any need.
Four years ago when I joined the Cafe I too thought it would be a good idea to do so but long standing members persuaded me that there was no need and they were correct.
 
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Those who are shy could put it in the beginners recordings with a link from here however I really do not think there is any need.
Four years ago when I joined the Cafe I too thought it would be a good idea to do so but long standing members persuaded me that there was no need and they were correct.
I beg to differ but I'll leave it at that
 

Jeanette

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I've moved this discussion to it's own thread.

There is often a reluctance to post with the experienced players but it is rare to receive anything other than helpful comments.

Be interesting to hear what other newer members think

Jx
 
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Thanks for moving it @Jeanette

From my experience of hosting the BOTM, ( I have noticed this in others BOTM's and SOTM's as well)

I have had the feeling that some members have been very close, but didn't quite have the confidence to post their own versions. I am not suggesting in anyway that they wouldn't get anything but encouragement if they did, but if it was a beginners thread I believe they would be more likely to contribute. There are some really good players posting and some people maybe feel a bit out of their depth. With it also only being visible to members that are logged in, I think this would be another encouragement..
I have no idea how complicated it would be to implement this but if I was hosting, I would be more than happy to run two threads at the same time.
If it got one beginner up and running each month I think it would be very worthwhile.
 

nigeld

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I remember the first few times that I posted, and it felt very scary.
But I don't think that having a separate beginners thread would have made it less so.
And I got nothing but helpful feedback.

Of course, when the first posting on a new thread is by someone really really good, then it can be a bit off-putting for us numpties,
but the ideal would be that we have a range of postings from very beginner to very good, and that often happens.

I think the only way to find out is to try it.
Looking at this months tunes, I feel that Porgy is easier that Fuji Mama.
So how about we create a beginners thread for Porgy and see what happens?
@Rob Pealing - are you happy with this?
@Jeanette - if I create a new thread, in the BOTM forum, can you make it only visible to members? Or does it need to be in the Beginners Recordings section?
 

tenorviol

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Scared sax player reporting in... I've never played solo (apart from frightening workshop experiences). Improv scares the living daylights out of me. I keep meaning to have a go but just playing the dots... but I'm not really that good a player
 
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Scared sax player reporting in... I've never played solo (apart from frightening workshop experiences). Improv scares the living daylights out of me. I keep meaning to have a go but just playing the dots... but I'm not really that good a player
Do you consider yourself a beginner and are you more likely to post in a beginner's thread
 

Colin the Bear

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The whole point of the exercise is to push yourself and by pushing, improving. The red recording light is very distracting for any one. The more you record the better you get at it. It's quite addictive.

We can be our own harshest critic. I can't count the number of recordings that I felt were unsatisfactory, only to find a week or so later that they weren't. I've stopped immediately deleting recordings.

The version you post doesn't have to be your first attempt. Listening back to your first attempt can guide you. You can hear what's missing or where a change is needed. In a live performance scenario, improv happens and is gone. Recording gives a player a second or third chance to develop a solo. I think a lot of beginners underestimate the amount of work that goes into a three minute clip.

You may not like your sound when you hear it back. however there's a lot of so called greats that I don't like. The only way to change it is to change it.

Beginner or pro, it's only music. Nobody dies but put the work in.

It's taken me several years to find the right mic and how to use it.

Taking part, beginner or pro, will produce improvements. Nobody starts out wonderful, but anyone can improve, if they aim high.

Personally I can't see the point of posting in a beginners thread. It's aiming low. Aim high. Jump in at the deep end. There's nothing done on an instrument that can't be done by anyone with practice. Put the work in and don't accept mediocrity. ;)
 

Rob Pealing

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@Jeanette Thank you for splitting of this conversation to a new thread.

@nigeld , "So how about we create a beginners thread for Porgy and see what happens?
@Rob Pealing - are you happy with this?"
I am happy to try it. If the moderators agree I will create a thread in the beginners section with link to the same files.

"Scared sax player reporting in... I've never played solo (apart from frightening workshop experiences)."
Although I have only four years under my belt and I think of myself as a beginner, I have played solo for friendly audiences so maybe I have a different perspective on this.
 

Jeanette

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@Jeanette - if I create a new thread, in the BOTM forum, can you make it only visible to members? Or does it need to be in the Beginners Recordings section?
@Rob Pealing - are you happy with this?" I am happy to try it. If the moderators agree I will create a thread in the beginners section with link to the same files.
Let me discuss with Pete first, we don't normally allow duplicate threads :)

Jx
 

Pete Thomas

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Let me discuss with Pete first, we don't normally allow duplicate threads :)
No they get very confusing.

But I'm a bit confused anyway (as usual) We already have a beginners sound clips forum (that is members only). And I think we discussed a while back that when beginners post to the other forums, it was better if they use the beginners thread prefix - and so people know they are a beginner and can be easy going with their criticism. That this would encourage more beginners to post.
 
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No they get very confusing.

But I'm a bit confused anyway (as usual) We already have a beginners sound clips forum (that is members only). And I think we discussed a while back that when beginners post to the other forums, it was better if they use the beginners thread prefix - and so people know they are a beginner and can be easy going with their criticism. That this would encourage more beginners to post.
The idea is to get them involved in the BOTM and the SOTM without them posting in the said threads
 
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