Subscriptions and donations are given to special needs music education charities
SYOS

Software BiaB Help - How hard is it to...

randulo

22 months since I began - 3.5% of my adult life
Subscriber
Messages
2,794
Location
France
I can't get the hang of BiaB on the Mac. I used to use it years ago, but haven't in a long time. I see now that if someone else does the work of entering an arrangement and chords, it wouldn't be too hard to change, key, tempo or individual chords. My question is, is it possible in a ballad to have it do the first and last verse at say 70 bpm straight, and then go to a swing feel for the one or two solo verses like many arrangement do?
 

jbtsax

Well-Known Member
Subscriber
Messages
7,275
Location
Beautiful Springville, Utah USA
I run BiaB on Windows 7 and I assume the features work the same way. What you want to do is quite simple. Find the measure where the A section starts. The measure number is in a blue box---the bridge starts at the measure in a green box.

Left click to select that measure, then do a right click. A menu appears that gives several choices. Click on "bar settings". That takes you to a box with numerous choices of variations for any of the choruses of your song. Check this out and let me know if you have any questions.
 
OP
randulo

randulo

22 months since I began - 3.5% of my adult life
Subscriber
Messages
2,794
Location
France
Thanks for that, I will try it. Right now, I am working hard on an unrelated musical project, but after that, I will dig in to BiaB. I actually worked for PG Music, translating their software to French, and owned most of their products on Windows XP! In fact, I remember working hard to find a good translation for "turnaround". I forgot it, but it's not something you can guess.
 

nigeld

I don't need another mouthpiece; but . . .
Subscriber
Messages
5,004
Location
Bristol, UK
Most styles in BIAB have 2 variants ("a" and "b"), so the middle section may be different than the verse. This is set by clicking on the blue and green boxes at the start of the bars. But you can add different "c" and "d" styles as well, so that the middle section has a completely different feel. Right-click on the blue/green box.
 
OP
randulo

randulo

22 months since I began - 3.5% of my adult life
Subscriber
Messages
2,794
Location
France
I must give this a try. BiaB tracks sound much better than iReal Pro, but they still sound robotic and quirky to me. If only I could trap a decent rhythm section and keep them in a closet.
 

Clivey

Senior Member
Messages
882
Location
Edinburgh/Hot Rock off African Coast
I'm on xp and what Nigel suggests with bar settings is what I do . I also pretty well do away with using repeats and compose linearly this really helps keep BIAB sane and avoids having to edit disable style markers volumes and changes all the way through numerous choruses though you need to check them as you go to avoid weirdness. Tee hee
Finally. I have stopped mixing in BIAB or RealBand .it's fine for composition and rough mix. But to really get the best from things I find that exporting the seperate Wavs is the way to go .Your common and garden DAW will make light work of editing and processing the track. For example if there is an amplitude difference in 2 different drum styles you simply highlight the section you want to normalise, it's great because you have the visual waveform to reference . Not 100% the same with tempos/rhythm but still easy .
I can't really comment on BIAB on MAC or after 2016.Things may have improved by miles . It's certainly an amazing piece of software and absolutely unique in what it does to the level it does it.
 

nigeld

I don't need another mouthpiece; but . . .
Subscriber
Messages
5,004
Location
Bristol, UK
I also pretty well do away with using repeats and compose linearly this really helps keep BIAB sane
I think I might start doing this too. Repeats and endings in BIAB are awful.
Trying to modify a repeat can be a nightmare - I had to do it the other day and the software seemed to add and delete bars at random. I'm sure there was a logic to it, but I have no idea what it was.
 

Colin the Bear

Well-Known Member
Messages
12,514
Location
Burnley bb9 9dn
For a band that sounds less robotic, select from real tracks and add some extended and substitute chords.

For a song/arrangement with an AABA structure having a different sequence for each A section really lifts the performance.

To get a more individual feel, I've been selecting midi styles and regenerating each player with a real player. I haven't found a way of changing the player from a real style but it's very straight forward to swap out midi for real.

Some of the single instrument styles are useful if you want to add instrumentation from the real player list. Adding two different guitars, having them play together, then muting one or the other for different passages helps disguise the mechanical nature of the finished thing.

Endings I find are sometimes the most frustrating to make it do what you want. The chord in the "end" sequence affects what the band will do. Sticking a 69 in there will give a different end to say a maj7. If some of the band carry on playing after others have finished it may help to add a tag ending and alter the number of bars in the tag.

The A and B sections are interchangeable. Clicking the blue or green box will cycle them so your AABA song can become a BBAB song.
Some styles have ABC and D.

Some styles play Swing in A and B and Bossa in C and D.

Nurse! He's rambling again.
 

jbtsax

Well-Known Member
Subscriber
Messages
7,275
Location
Beautiful Springville, Utah USA
Well that's fine for AABA songs and BBAB songs but what about ABBA songs and should they be allowed anway?
I taught a high school music theory class years ago. One one of my tests the question read: What is ABBA? The answer of course is "a three part or ternary form". One smart aleck student answered "a Swedish pop group" which I marked wrong since I had never heard of them. The next day he brought in a record album (this was the early '70's) to prove he was right and his score went up a point. I listened to some of their songs and have been a fan ever since.
 
OP
randulo

randulo

22 months since I began - 3.5% of my adult life
Subscriber
Messages
2,794
Location
France
I sort of figured out some of this, with the help of @nigeld and @jbtsax and someone else, I think, but I stopped reading after the joking began. Yesterday, I entered an entire 32-bar song for the first time in ten or more years. It was the changes to a ballad my pianist brother sent me. I must say I like very much what BiaB does with this kind of thing. However, my biggest problem was with the end. I tried to just end it on the tonic and that didn't sound right, like it's an extra bar or something. I tried to add a tag, something like VI - ii - V - I and that's when I dropped in time sink mode, a black hole of trying ever variable to see why the audio render would just cut off right before the end. I will try to formulate a more precise question with screen captures so some kindly person can maybe walk me through it.
 
OP
randulo

randulo

22 months since I began - 3.5% of my adult life
Subscriber
Messages
2,794
Location
France
Scanning over again, thanks to @Colin the Bear & @Clivey. Nigel's advice about just laying out the song without trying to use sections is counter intuitive but valid. That's what I ended up doing and I think they say to start that way in the docs.
 

nigeld

I don't need another mouthpiece; but . . .
Subscriber
Messages
5,004
Location
Bristol, UK
I sort of figured out some of this, with the help of @nigeld and @jbtsax and someone else, I think, but I stopped reading after the joking began. Yesterday, I entered an entire 32-bar song for the first time in ten or more years. It was the changes to a ballad my pianist brother sent me. I must say I like very much what BiaB does with this kind of thing. However, my biggest problem was with the end. I tried to just end it on the tonic and that didn't sound right, like it's an extra bar or something. I tried to add a tag, something like VI - ii - V - I and that's when I dropped in time sink mode, a black hole of trying ever variable to see why the audio render would just cut off right before the end. I will try to formulate a more precise question with screen captures so some kindly person can maybe walk me through it.
Getting the ending to work is, in my experience, one of the hardest and most frustrating issues with BIAB.
If you are. not repeating the song, then try this:
- set “Start - End x Choruses” to 1, last bar, 1
- right-click on any bar, and select “song settings”
- tick “Generate 2-bar ending for this song”
- untick “Use 4-bar ending for RealTracks”
- tick “Start the ending 2 bars early”
- “Fadeout ending # bars =“ 0
- Click “OK”
 

rhysonsax

Well-Known Member
Messages
3,740
Location
Surrey, UK
Getting the ending to work is, in my experience, one of the hardest and most frustrating issues with BIAB.
If you are. not repeating the song, then try this:
- set “Start - End x Choruses” to 1, last bar, 1
- right-click on any bar, and select “song settings”
- tick “Generate 2-bar ending for this song”
- untick “Use 4-bar ending for RealTracks”
- tick “Start the ending 2 bars early”
- “Fadeout ending # bars =“ 0
- Click “OK”
I think that BiaB is "buggy" in how it deal with endings and infuriatingly inconsistent. Sometimes one instrument ploughs on while the others play a nice ending. And sometimes it works fine on one play-through and then doesn't work next time !

Surely PGMusic are aware of the problems and could sort it out.

Rhys
 

nigeld

I don't need another mouthpiece; but . . .
Subscriber
Messages
5,004
Location
Bristol, UK
Endings and repeats are both horrible in BIAB.
As far as I can tell, the only way to remove a repeat is to remove all of them.
 
OP
randulo

randulo

22 months since I began - 3.5% of my adult life
Subscriber
Messages
2,794
Location
France
Ok, I think I have it. A fermata on the last chord stopped it form playing an extra annoying tonic bar. Finding fermata in BiaB was a little extra fun, it's in Chord Settings under "Hold".

Is there a setting for "don't pound that last piano chord"?
 

jbtsax

Well-Known Member
Subscriber
Messages
7,275
Location
Beautiful Springville, Utah USA
Another option for an ending to a song is to repeat the 4 bar introduction at the end and then put a hold on the tonic chord on the first beat of the A section. I too have been frustrated by trying to find a BiaB ending that I can live with.
 
Saxholder Pro

Members OnlineStatistics

Help!

Sign up to the Mailing List

Latest posts

Top Bottom