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Reeds Am I going mad ! Reeds and Embouchure

Jez Watson

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I recently decided that I need to get more stuck into playing sax, so I started to practice more regular and also look for somewhere to go to play/find an ensemble in a jazz vibe.
Things were going well and my embouchure started feeling more stable, I even ordered a new box of reeds! (Rico royal). Reeds came and gave em a soak and played through them and marked them in my usual manner of good to bad.
Circumstances dictated that I couldn’t play for next two days so got sax out today and put a new reed on that I had marked as good and it was crap, tried another, just same, got Reedgeek out and adjusted them but not much improvement, got some old Java’s out and managed to find two that were reasonable but while this is going on my embouchure that was feeling more stable recently feels more unstable today and found myself tightening up a lot especially on the top notes which isn’t that unusual for me but something I was addressing with my new practice regime, very pissed off as a result but realise I have to soldier on, so what’s your experience, anything similar? Or am I going mad!!!
 
I think it's part and parcel of the beguiling nature of learning this instrument. I can pick up my Sax 3,4,5 times a day and get different results and levels of performance every time. It may on occasion be the hardware, but it's probably more likely to be the operator.
The last couple of days I've been really happy with my sound. I've felt really expressive and fluent (relative to the time I've been playing) But go back to the beginning of the week I'd somehow developed a terrible squeak that a change of reed could not resolve.
 
Try plastic.

I have tried plastic coated and synthetic reeds, I don’t like them and they have something in the sound that I don’t like and they are not as good as a good cane Reed I’m my experience, they work for some but I don’t get on with them.
 
I have tried plastic coated and synthetic reeds, I don’t like them and they have something in the sound that I don’t like and they are not as good as a good cane Reed I’m my experience, they work for some but I don’t get on with them.
I suppose the lack of consistency in cane reeds is the price you're willing to pay for the sound quality of a really good one - if and when you find it. My theory about plastic reeds is that you learn to play what you've got and to get a sound out of it that suits, but I'm told that my sound (which seems OK to me) leaves much to be desired, so perhaps I'd better scrap that idea!
 
I suppose the lack of consistency in cane reeds is the price you're willing to pay for the sound quality of a really good one - if and when you find it. My theory about plastic reeds is that you learn to play what you've got and to get a sound out of it that suits, but I'm told that my sound (which seems OK to me) leaves much to be desired, so perhaps I'd better scrap that idea!

When I’m feeling relaxed with a good reed my sound is not an issue, it could be that for many years I have been very inconsistent in my practice and have just got by on inconsistent playing, what’s frustrating is not being able to practice till 2pm as I live in a flat with a shift worker upstairs and sometimes there are things to do when it gets to that time , it’s hard getting the consistency.
 
I learned over the years that consistency is the key. One thing that really made a difference with my students was to make sure they put the top teeth in exactly the same spot on the mouthpiece every time they played. Mouthpiece patches help. The other thing is to adjust the neck strap to exactly the same length every time. This is why I prefer the old fashioned belt style that you set and forget.
 
I learned over the years that consistency is the key. One thing that really made a difference with my students was to make sure they put the top teeth in exactly the same spot on the mouthpiece every time they played. Mouthpiece patches help. The other thing is to adjust the neck strap to exactly the same length every time. This is why I prefer the old fashioned belt style that you set and forget.

Yes i always take an inch of mpc in, i learnt on a HR Otto Link , although i have been playing almost 30 years its been very inconsistent as it wasn't my main instrument and i agree that consistency is the main thing.
 
I learned over the years that consistency is the key.
And that's the case for plastic reeds. When I played cane, I used to waste ages of my practice time swapping reeds to find one I liked. Now I just pick up my sax and blow.
I wonder whether there's a psychological element to this? I suspect that when I was playing cane reeds I started with expectation that I'd have to find a reed that suited me and with that in mind I fiddled about when there was no need. Now, with plastic, I know my reed is OK so I get on with playing.
Incidentally, I never have reed problems with my alto. I don't have a plastic reed for it - I don't play it often enough to justify the rather expensive business of finding which plastic reed works - but I can pick it up and play it straightaway. Because I know it's right, it is right?
 
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I think this happens to some degree to all players, you just have to play through it, it will come good again.
2 days of not playing are not going to undo years of playing, but it can be annoying until you get your mojo back.
 
You said it man ;)
I didn't mean that I can get my head round Eb transpositions. Bb's hard enough.
Often I am asked, why don't people have saxophones that play in C instead of doing all this transposing stuff. I find that one hard to answer in a way that convinces me, especially as I have a C-mel lying unused.
 
My (very amateur) experience is that things change. My stress level, the level at which the mpc enters my mouth (strap position), my embouchure, reed quality, suitability and age, and the position of the ligature and reed on the mpc. All these are variables together determine tone and ease of playing.

One of the most valuable resources I've come across is an article on Reed Placement and Adjustment by Dr. Steven Mauk, Professor of Saxophone at Ithaca College. Professor Mauk has published many other publicly available resources on sax playing.

I use the information in this article every time I play (before playing and often for fine tuning when playing).

I don't know why your 'good reeds' suddenly become 'mediocre/bad' reeds. But my experience is that a couple of milimeters difference in either the ligature or reed position w.r.t. the mouthpiece tip can make a big difference,

Maybe the differences you describe are due to changes in the reeds. But it's worth checking whether they're due to small variations in your setup.

Mike
 
It could simply be the weather affecting your cane. We have had a sudden change from autumn to winter weather and that might have caused it. If, so, your reeds will play fine again in a few days.

I keep Plasticovers in the case for situations like this.
 
I just put them on and play. Once I find a reed type that works, they all work. Well, almost all. I don't reject more than 1 every 4 boxes
 
It gets better. Reeds are flighty, unpredictable, awkward things for the first few years of most players learning, but the more you play, the better you get, the less disruptive they become. Never one to throw stuff away, I've got boxes of what are probably perfectly usable reeds that for some reason I didn't get on with once upon a time - now, I buy a box and play through the contents one by one, no drama. I would go back and re-use those old rejects but having settled on Marca as my brand of choice, I find those old Ricos and Vandorens just don't do it for me any more.....
 
I decided to take a step back in my setup today and use my Windcraft ebonite mpc, I spoke to Anton at Dawkes a few years ago about these and he told me that they are actually an Otto Link new vintage in a 6 lay with Windcraft embossed on top. I used an old 2.5 java on it and immediately it felt very comfortable and I could play with a relaxed embouchure, it’s pretty obvious to me that I am playing too tense and also tensing up in the palm keys through lack of practice up there, also when I go back to a mpc like the HR Link I always feel more comfortable as I played on one for quite a long time in my early years on sax, it became apparent also that this setup was a little to easy and didn’t offer quite enough resistance but I would put that down to the reed being very well blown in.
 
The reed bears no responsibility for the player fudging keys.

Clean the mouthpiece. I like to use toothpaste and a toothbrush and then rinse with an alcohol mouthwash.

Check the reed for damage, moisten it and mount it on the mouthpiece. Be very careful to set it central, both ends and flush with the tip rail. If it plays a little hard move it back 0.25mm if a little soft, move it the same amount forward and try again. Make sure the lig fits and is behind the window of the mouthpiece.

Run the cleaner through the sax body and swab out the crook.

Assemble the instrument. Open and close all keys and observe that G#, and C# are opening. Finger G2 then G and A, A2. Watch the octave pads opening and closing. Alternate A2 and G2 and observe the octave keys switching between body and neck. Check there is a little free play between neck octave mechanism and the pin.

Try playing. The reed may be suddenly better.

Ifa reed is good and suddenly bad, it's probably not the reed. Same thing with varying numbers of reeds being good and bad. Since I refaced my mouthpiece 10 out of 10 reeds play. Some are wonderful, some are ok but all play.
 
The reed bears no responsibility for the player fudging keys.

Clean the mouthpiece. I like to use toothpaste and a toothbrush and then rinse with an alcohol mouthwash.

Check the reed for damage, moisten it and mount it on the mouthpiece. Be very careful to set it central, both ends and flush with the tip rail. If it plays a little hard move it back 0.25mm if a little soft, move it the same amount forward and try again. Make sure the lig fits and is behind the window of the mouthpiece.

Run the cleaner through the sax body and swab out the crook.

Assemble the instrument. Open and close all keys and observe that G#, and C# are opening. Finger G2 then G and A, A2. Watch the octave pads opening and closing. Alternate A2 and G2 and observe the octave keys switching between body and neck. Check there is a little free play between neck octave mechanism and the pin.

Try playing. The reed may be suddenly better.

Ifa reed is good and suddenly bad, it's probably not the reed. Same thing with varying numbers of reeds being good and bad. Since I refaced my mouthpiece 10 out of 10 reeds play. Some are wonderful, some are ok but all play.

My experience which is over the last 29 years of playing sax and alongside professional sax players as a bass player doesn’t agree with your finding on reeds Colin, there are many reasons why a reed might be great one day and not the next, in my experience it’s usually that the Reed has gone convex or concave on the back , the reeds I mentioned in the post were new and I have often experienced reeds going stiffer the next day after first breaking them in, as for all your reeds playing all I can say is you are the only one I have heard of that has experienced that?
Where did you learn mouthpiece refacing?
 

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